Hi All, we have an off-gird system using two LG resu 6.5 batteries in parallel with each other which is monitored with a Venus GX. The LGs also get tied to a large AGM setup at certain times of the day to share the charging. Overall the system is monitored and controlled by many Sonoff switches and a few Orange Pi's running a common bash script which works pretty well for us.
One very minor outstanding issue is the Venus GX only shows one LG battery at a time. If we unplug a canbus cable from one of the batteries, the VGX will show the other and vice versa, but the VGX will never show both at the same time. The VGX shows them both as Product: LG resu battery and Product ID: B004. Is it because they have the same product details? Do they need to be daisy chained rather than each connected directly to a canbus port on the VGX?
Its surprising the VGX can't tell it has two batteries connected to it..
Hi, I am just trying to get my head around this and wonder if someone can confirm it please?
For a 12-15vdc battery off grid system needing to charge through a charge controller via a solar panel array of course which the panels are rated at around 55Vdcmax.
With the cheaper Ebay MPPT controllers (link to example type bellow), they cut off the solar panels inputs if the solar panel voltages are above around 15Vdc, so effectively the panel would only charge the system when the panel voltage is within the 12vdc - 15vdc, effectively only for a VERY short time in the morning and again at sunset.
With a Victron charge controller like (link of example type below), to charge the 12-15vdc from the panels (55Vdc). Does the Victron charge controller cater for the full 0-55vdc from the panel or does it also have built in cut out solar voltage cut offs, resulting in the same issue as the cheaper Ebay charge controllers?
I guess I am looking to have some device which converts the 0-55Vdc to a more usable 12-15vdc range so as to charge the batteries. Is the Victron charge controllers able to do that, regardless of the voltage from the solar panels are producing?
In Germany an Off-Grid system with any kind of AC Grid connection (even totally disconnected) on the same piece of land is considered "parallel operation". If we indirectly or directly connect any "generator" (including Multiplus or Quattro regardless of configuration) to the grid we are no longer in parallel operation and a ton of rules, bureaucracy, tax, and even remote control is applicable! So long as the sun shines everything is okay, until winter...
Even with an oversized "full roof" solar array, in winter especially with EVs, the only way I see to cover the couple of months with poor sun BUT keeping ALL the electronics Off-Grid is to trickle CHARGE the batteries from the Grid for a few days/week at a time. For example, like an ad-hoc/mobile EV charger or electric oven we can draw up to 3,6kVA from a "charger" 24/7 without breaking rules to deliver 86kWH/day. Using the battery as a buffer, we can then trickle charge the EVs for a few hours each day, cover heating and entertainment requirements. On the DC side everything is perfect with Multis/Quattros even using DC power directly to reduce battery cycles.
It's important for me to keep ALL the electronics Off-Grid so that I have (almost) complete freedom to choose the power rating and technology within my system. My Grid distribution box will only contain a couple of power sockets for testing plus chargers split evenly across all phases, that's it. The energy company has nothing to say about the rest (common electrical safety respected). ;-)
Of course, the basic assumption here is "not direct or indirectly connected" regards AC/Grid power. Here we only have DC connectivity between the Grid and Off-Grid systems, technically they are only "connected" via magnetic fields.
Now the question...
The Skylla 48v 25A charger appears to be the only option (x3 <= 3.6kVA), is expensive at 900€ each as I have to buy 3 (2700€), but not very smart at all. There is no way to share temperature, voltage sense and BMS control via any VE bus (Direct or CAN). I could get a Multiplus or Quattro at similar prices but those can feed energy back to the grid which is not allowed. I guess I have to use them as dumb chargers with the remote switch/relay and shunt to fill-in for the missed capability.
The Skylla may even have to be set in power supply mode to prevent its charge logic conflicting with the BMS or much higher than spec capacity house battery? :-( I'd really like to keep a pure Victron installation but if it comes down to power supply mode then are there any 3rd party 48v chargers which integrate with VenusOS or a VE bus?
I hear the rules are very simple in the Netherlands, perhaps why Victron don't see this requirement? Then Victron don't make "Smart" 48v chargers because they feel the demand is covered by the Multiplus and Quattro? But these devices CAN return energy to the Grid, so considered "energy production" devices, which IS a problem for evermore people seeking Off-Grid as a solution to the politics or just want freedom of choice.
Or is there something I missed here... For example, is it impossible to return power via the AC2 input of a Quattro with physical/electronic limitation (it would have to be documented also with a schematic as proof for the energy provider)?
To prevent DC and AC voltage overshoots because of varying solar irradiance and/or load fluctuations, it will limit the charge current already before battery voltage has rised up to the absorption voltage. It will derate the maximum charge current from 100% at 13.5 / 27 / 54V to 10% at 14.4 / 28.8 / 57.6V. These thresholds are not related to the configured absorption voltage.
Hello, knowing this has already been increased a few years ago and is somehow necessary, I'm still wondering about the reasonableness of the fact the voltages are fixed.
In my opinion this should consider capacity:inverter ratio and especially battery type and voltages! Using a relatively small inverter in a big sized lead acid offgrid installation this makes the AC-coupled power pretty useless for charging, although lead acid doesn't care much about overvoltage!
Now let's look at the Pylontech or other 15s Lithium-Storages, that probably don't even have a GX. Their absorption voltage is below 54V so there is no derating at all, although Li can be damaged by overvoltage? Further this means 15s systems can use the full power for charging while 16s or lead acid systems are extremely disadvantaged. Due to the fact that this is for protection I don't understand why some systems can use the full power up to absorption voltage and others cannot.
Can someone tell me the technical background of the fact that the voltages and the derating are fixed and anything else isn't considered? Probably @Johannes Boonstra (Victron Energy Staff)
Thank you very much!
We have just replaced batteries with Pylontech US3000 x 2 on an existing off grid solar system. We are getting a high voltage warning with the SOC at 81%. We have updated all the firmware to the lastest release as directed on the victron and pylontech page.
Here are the details of the system
Victron easy solar with 48V, 3KVA Multiplus, 150/70 blue solar MPPT, 2 x US3000 Pylontech Batteries.
CCGX - V2.63
MultiPlus 3KVA - V2620459
MPPT 150/70 - V1.54
VRM Portal ID - 508cb1e4251b
I would like to know how to manage the excess PV production once the batteries are full and all electric needs are supplied. I want to send that exceedance to a water heater for an off-grid. Thanks
Can Quattro or Multiplus II work as on-grid inverters without connecting batteries?
I'm turning a truck into a campervan/housetruck, and since I have the roof space I would like to use excess solar to run a small hot water system. I have 12x200W (40V@5A) panels, and I'm thinking 24V to match the truck. The loads will total less than 3000VA because I'm willing to use one cooking appliance at a time (I have been doing this already as a test). I'd rather ask dumb questions of online forums than people trying to make a living selling solar setups, so here I am :)
I think I want something like this: either MPPT 150/100 (3s4p, 120V strings) or MPPT 250/100 (6s2p, 240V strings) feeding a Multiplus 24/3000/70 with a Color Control GX and BMV-702 battery monitor. In Australia a Sentry 24V/150AH is $4000 ($1.05/Wh, charge at 60A) while the Victron 24/200 is $6695 ($1.35/wh, charge at 100A) and I'm not keen on spending the extra $3000 if I don't have to. I don't need the extra storage, just the extra charge current acceptance.
Hot water can be either 240V AC or 24V DC, element changes are easy. And the thermostat will cut power when the tank is hot enough.
The question is how I get the power diversion to work. I'm told it can be done but I have been wandering round the Victron website feeling lost. Please advise.
Second question: if I want to limit charge current to 60A, can I use a MultiPlus 24/3000/70 rather than needing a 24/5000/100 and program it to limit the charge current?
thanks for any help
i've decided to prepare myself and install power backup system for my house with off-grid in mind.
I hope and I ask for that that Victron professionals will step in and help me to identify necesssary building blocks. Let me draw a picture:
1. the current situation: my house has 3-phase power supply: L1, L2, L3, N, PE. It's in Europe so it is 230VAC between L-N, and 400 VAC between L-L. This 3-phase power is distributed in my electric switchboard so different phases power lights, wall sockets, appliances (washing machine, gas heater, fridges, PCs and so forth...) - to spread the load more or less evenly between the phases. I have devices powered by 3-phase as well: induction cooking, electric oven and sauna. In my garage i'm using 3-phase powered tools - i'm talking aobut 3-phase induction motors, among them, the biggest one is 5.5kW air compressor and milling machine (1.5kW spindle, 3.7kW spindle, 0.6kW power feed, 1.1kW power feed), lathe 1.5kW, welding machine... Of course i'm not using all the machines at the same time. I a hobby guy, not factory.
My first assumption is my garage will not be off-grid as it will probably be VERY expensive to build off-grid system to cope with my machines - both in terms of power delivery and energy storage.
Due to the above lets assume power backup with off-grid option for the house only. I have an electric car battery (chevy volt) 28kWh of energy in 2kWh 12S 48V Li-Ion modules - this is my energy storage.
For charging i plan to install PV panels and i have two small wind turbines (200W only).
What would be the recommended setup to have the possibility to disconnect myself from city mains while i'm not using workshop machines.
I'm afraid going 3-phase using Victron toys will be super expensive (for the average Joe). How about 1-phase inverter for the beginning and connect lights, sockets, fridge, freezer, PCs, TVs, internet, whasing machine, kettle to one or two phases (i mean use inverter AC output bridged in main switchboard to L1 and L2 with an interlock making sure it will be possible with city power isolated).
Victron have so many devices that i'm lost. Is it better to use inverter and a separated battery bank charger? Or inverter-charger combined device? Or maybe solar inverter charger? So many options.
For sure i can not go below 3kW AC output, 5kW preferably. The cost is rising high quickly... Which chargers are suitable to work with 14S Li-Ion battery banks (remember i'll use Chevy Volt modules)?
How to design the system so i can connect additional PV panels in the future if it turn out that my PV panels are not strong enough to keep my powerwall charged or i decide to add more batteries.
I'm not a millionare - this is another thing to take into account:)
Please, let's talk and draw some picture:)
My generator is not summing the amount of data in the hystorical data grid In. Can I change the grid in to generator?
At the moment the absdorption saying is 57.6v for absorption but the PV inverter support assistant ramps down Fronius when the batteries are at 54v so it takes far too long to charge the batteries under solar. When the generator is on, it will charge at 180amps until 57.6v then go into absorption then float as it's supposed to but when it's under solar it will charge at 180amps to 54v then ramp down considerably so even though the charger wants the power the PV inverter assistant won't allow it. Can the setings be changed in the PV inverter support assistant to chasnge it from 54v to 57.6 as per the charger setting?
I have a very annoying problem with my off-grid setup of a Multiplus II 48-3000 and a Fronius Primo 3.0-1 PV Inverter. As soon as the Fronius connects its Power Unit through, the voltage starts oscillating from 200 to 250V and the frequency (according to my Cerbo) from 49.9 to 50.1, as you can see here: MAP001.jpg
It stays this way as long as the MP is charging the Battery (200Ah LiFePo4, no limit from the Battery Current etc.) or as long as there are no loads > 500W delivered from the battery (e.g. I turn on my heater).
As soon as the frequency rises above 50.2 Hz (when Throttling) the problem disappears, so I assume there are some regulators oscillating which parameters I can't change.
I've already tried updating the Firmware both of the Muptiplus as well as the Primo. The Primo is on the MG50 setup, the MP has the PV Assistant loaded.
I've tried to adjust the voltage between 210 and 240V, which has no effect. If there was a way to fine adjust the freqency I would do just that, as it would solve the problem to set it to 50.3 or so, as I have no clocks on the system, but there seems to be no way to set anything except 50.0 or 60.0 unfortunately - whereas with 60 Hz the issue is also there.
I'm kind of disappointed as everything works fine except this problem, which seems to also affect my batteries, because the battery current also oscillates quite much as a result, which causes problems when balancing.
Thanks so much for your help!
I'm new to this place and would like your feedback if I understood the Victron components' abilities and purpose correctly as there is such a large amount of different products.
The aim is a system for one household which can work off-grid and if grid is available, as UPS or supporting the gird. Feed-in is neither possible nor desired. Also, it should be extendible for both more panels and more batteries.
Obviously I aiming for the Muiltiplus, whereas I'm not sure of I need the Multiplus II or if an older Multiplus is also sufficient. On the battery-side, I plan for 24V (battery type yet to be defined).
As the Multiplus' advantage is that the current from the panels could come in on the DC side as well as on the AC side, I could then connect panels with (one or multiple) BlueSolar/SmartSolar charger to the batteries plus to Multiplus on DC-side, right? And additionally I could connect panels (could be ones which are farther away) with a line-communted inverter, is that correct? May I also use (multiple) micro-inverters on the AC-side safely?
Thanks for your answers in advance
We are completely off grid and Using MultiPlus 48volt/5000va/70amp/230v. Had a week with no sun, so batteries were drained. Had to hook up backup generator. Generator had been on for 15 mins +/- and I heated something in the microwave and the power went out. Tried flipping main switch on power panel inside house - did not work. Had to flip the "On/Off/Charge Only" button on the inverter box to restore power to the house. When the generator is on, shouldn't everything work? Before we got our new system we had to frequently use the backup generator. As long as it was on, everything in the house would work. Thanks for any help.
Ik heb sinds kort een nieuwe boot en daar zit een Victron Phoenix Multiplus 24 1600 40 in.
Nu blijkt dat ik, wanneer ik van de walstroom af ben, geen 220V heb als ik de omvormer aanzet. Het lampje gaat aan van omvorming, maar er is geen spanning.
Wanneer ik de walstroom erop zet is er weer 220V
kan het zijn dat ik te weinig accu vermogen heb staan?
er zitten 2 accu’s in, Beaut AGM260-12, 12V 260ah.
Moet er wellicht meer in?
ik hoop dat iemand een antwoord heeft.
We have a couple of Multiplus v2 5k, a 5k AC coupled Fronius, 4 BYD b-box LV 48v batteries and a Cerbo to tie it all together.
Now I want to limit the charging voltage on the BYD batteries from 58.4 volt to 56.4 volt. According to Will Prowse this will greatly increase battery lifetime. Please correct me if I'm wrong.
I have no idea how to do this. In Venus OS, the CVL option under the BYD parameters is not changeable. Do I need to do this in the BYD software somehow?
Thanks in advance,
I need to replace an entirely broken 12V offgrid system of a remote northern cabin in real cold climate. The new setup is: Smart Solar 100/50 & BMV-712, Panels 2 x 250Wp, Batteries 2 x 6V AGM DeepCycle 190Ah. So far the old system was shut off during the winter period where there is twilight for 4 hrs only. (Batteries fully loaded , then disconnected for 6 months). Now I am wondering if it would make sense to leave the System powered up so the Batteries would be at least kept alive. However I did not find any clear information if the Smart Solar's self consumption of 30mA is always the same or if will be less if solar power is gone. Appreciate any information and hints how to keep the batteries alive.
When bulk charging is in effect in Venus OS on Raspberry Pi 4 B with SmartSolar 100/20 MPPT system, the charging line is not animated toward the battery. Instead, the animated line is directed to the upper icon. Does this mean that either the Venus OS or MPPT are not properly configured? If so, what changes do I need to make?
This is a DC only off-grid system in which AC inputs and loads are not present.
I would like to know what is the technical difficulty of having an off grid system running in ess mode. If ess can work as aback up for a week because of grid failure of one week, it is effectively running as off grid. So what would be the complication of that?
I have an issue similiar to GSM modem offline 3.
We are running 8 off-grid systems (Multiplus + Cerbo GX) in Malawi, with more coming. Comms is through the Victron 4G GSM dongle using Airtel (mostly) or TNM sims. On commissioning, all systems were online. However, during the first couple of days, five systems dropped (and remained) offline while three have remained online.
The "worst" example dropped offline 12 days ago, never to reappear. None of the systems that have been more than a few minutes offline have recovered. At the same time, we have other GSM based equipment onsite that has remained online. Some sites are clearly far off grid, but weak signal locations have extra antennas. Connection drop does not seem to only his weak connection sites. It takes between an hour and a day to reach these sites from the capital, hence we need to go prepared.
We have been to the first (closest) site to assess. Site has good Airtel coverage, but we first tried TNM, and the GSM/Cerbo produced error 153 (Routing error). With an Airtel sim it complained about APN for a few minutes before going online with good reception. (3 bars), allowing remote VRM login. After leaving the site, the connection dropped within an hour, never to recover.
- Cerbo GX Firmware version v2.70~5-large-18
- APN: set to “Use Default”. Required APN is “internet” for both Malawi carriers. Since we had access, I do not consider this the root cause, but we are happy to change this. We have set this to "internet" for one of the working connections, this works too.
- Settings->VRM-> «Reboot device on no contact with VRM» was not enabled at first. We have instructed that new installations should enable this feature. However, this is in my opinion a way around the problem rather than a real repair.
- FW update set to "Check only" to avoid uncontrolled updates and data use.
- Roaming is off. Will enabling this give us greater chances of remaining online?
Is there anything Victron or us can do here? Could there be a specific airtel/TNM Malawi<-->Victron issue that prevents the cerbo to reconnect if connection drops? Any advice would be good before we start driving around the country.
Doing some system planning for a global voyaging boat. The RS 48/6000 looks like a great solution because I can keep the AC system completely separate from AC shore power. In effect all AC loads will always be on inverter 100% of the time. This will eliminate voltage and frequency issues for when shore power by using separate AC battery chargers in combination with robust solar and alternators.
1- I got feedback from a Victron dealer that "HF inverters" like the RS 48/6000 are less reliable and should not be used for full time. Suggested that reliability was not as good with HF designs and they can't handle extended use. Is this really true? I understand that many "Chinese" inverters are HF designs and may contribute to the opinion but is there something inherently flawed in an HF design making it not suitable for full time use? Any reason why a more traditional larger transformer design inverter may be a better choice?
2- Understand that you are launching a Multi RS Solar 48/6000/80-400/80 charger version in January. This sounds like the perfect solution for my setup. Are specs available for this? Key question is if the 80 amp AC charger is simply that, an AC charger and the AC input is isolated (all AC loads are 100% inverter). There is no relay correct? Reason I would want this is to enable global shore power (using an autotransformer) that is frequency independent. Also, is the MPPT charger output shared with the AC charger or is it completely independent?
I am currently planning to do some upgrade to my offgrid cabin. Today we use two 35 kVA three phase diesel generators (one in standby) to supply power to the cabin. The average power consumption is about 50-100 kWh per day, but most is used in the morning and evening. Peak power is just under 10 kW, during most of the day it is only 1-2 kW. I therefore want to install about 20 kWh of Li-Ion batteries to be able to shut off the diesel generators during the daytime.
There are only a couple of three phase loads in the system and none of them need to be able to run while on battery power. I got hold of an older 10 kW 48V Quattro 230 V that I am planning to use for this purpose.
Would it be possible to just connect the Quattro inline to two of the phases in the system and then run single phase when on battery and three phase while on genset ?
My initial thought is that it should in theory be possible as long as the inverter section in the Quattro never runs at the same time as the genset ? Then make sure i rewire the fuse box in the cabin to ensure that all the loads that i want to be able to power from battery is connected to the two phases coming from the Quattro.
I believe that my genset has contactors for the supply, so when the genset is not running, the third phase would be physically disconnected from the generator. I understand that i will also need some contactors with some smarts to ensure to disconnect the two live phases on the three phase loads when on battery to ensure that i do not damage the equipment. Running with 2 phases live on a three phase load is likely to cause problems :)
A bit unusual setup I am sure, but if anyone have some thoughts or have done similar things I would be very interested to hear about it. The simple solution would probably be to purchase two additional Quattros, but that would be very expensive since i do not really need three phase.
At the same time I would like to not change over to a pure single phase system as my gensets are three phase and it would be good to get some of the loads that i do not need to be able to power off battery to be on other phases on the genset so that I get a more even phase load on the genset while it is running
So if I connect a Multiplus II like in the schematic attached will I have an option to keep the system on-grid?(Giving the unnecessary power back to the grid) If this is possible can someone explain to me how and will it work with an "off brand" inverter that my parents have.(It is an Selfa brand so if anyone has experirience with those inverters please help) Zrzut ekranu (138).png
I have installed an EasySolar 5000VA off-grid in a mountain cabin. The chassis/case of the EasySolar is grounded by connecting it to an earth-rod (1.5m deep into the ground, but thinking of expanding it to 3m).
The EasySolar has a RCD and therefore I have activated the earth-relay in the VEConfig settings.
I like to know, if this is considered a TT System? According to Wiring-Unlimited I would say it is.
The reason for this question is, as an addition to the lightning-protection, I like to install a surge arrester for the AC part of the system. I was thinking of this one: https://www.dehn.de/store/f/11393939/Artikelnummer_PDF/952310.pdf
For the DC part I have already installed one (https://www.dehn.de/store/p/de-DE/F43290/ueberspannungsableiter-typ-2-dehnguard-me-mehrpolig-fuer-pv-anlagen-bis-1500v-dc-?product=P223241#P223241)
And other little side-question: In Wiring-Unlimited I saw on page 64&65 under off-grid system grounding that I have to ground the battery negative pole? Totally didn't do that... is this a problem? Because when I look at a diagram for automotive, I don't see the battery being grounded. eg. https://www.victronenergy.de/upload/documents/DS-Lucians-Victron-Van-Automotive-Full.pdf
I see that the busbar/lynx is grounded, but I was assuming, this is built in into the Easy-Solar. But if not, its easy for me to rework and add a grounding to the battery.
And yes, next year in spring when the snow is gone and I'm able to get up there by car, I will have an electrician to check the whole installation due to insurance approval requirements. Therefore I like him to complain as few as possible / rework as few as possible since it is a really long travel to get up there.
I want to connect two existing systems together
3 x 15KVA Quattro
4 x 250/100 MPPT
2 x 30kWh Freedom Won Lithium
1 x 45KVA Generator
3 x 10KVA Quattro
2 x 250/100 MPPT
2 x 15kWh Freedom Won Lithium
1 x 30KVA Generator
These two system are 100m apart and I know they can complement each other with excess power by sharing it between each other via an AC cable acting as a 'grid'
Maybe connect output1 of system A to input1 of system B and vice versa. Then both generators to input 2 (separately per respective inverter)
Our supplier here in Norway configured multiplus ii like like that just found out, but seems like we emptied the batteries. One day the power cut off. 37v is the lowest in smartshunt history tab. So it seems multplus ii never cut off the mains as a precaution, but let the main draw to the bitter end. Probably damaged the 48v 200Ah battery bank.
1350 W solar panels and MPPT
Victron carbon lead batteries 200ah
Honda 2kw genset
Feedback appreciated :)
given the sunspec (modbus) support the current 3p SMAs have, could i expect an equivalent set of features and integration options as Fronius systems have already in the past ?
We're going completely offgrid due to the distance we are from power lines. I'm needing some guidance on a good offgrid setup and how to go about building it and programming it. Here's what I'm planning on using:
- Victron 48/500/70
- Victron Colour control GX
- Victron 85 amp controller
- JA Modue Solar 390W panels
- BYD 4.0kwh x4 with BMU and unit OR 4x Pylontech 3.55kwh
- Timber ground mount with flush mount system
I'm having a couple of electrician buddies coming around to give me a hand installing it all but they haven't every installed offgrid solar before.
My questions are:
1. Is installation a fairly straightforward process for your average electrician or even home handy man?
2. Is there anything I need to be aware of before we get to work?
3. Is the programming fairly straight forward?
4. Is there any issues with either of these setups or recommendations on a better setup?
5. Good bang for buck?
Thanks in advance!
the manual (https://www.victronenergy.com/live/actor_offgrid ) says that when using AC-Thor in an off-grid system frequency shifting (PV-inverter assistent) has to be activated at the Multi.
- Is this also necessary if only DC-coupled PV is used (no PV-inverter on AC-out)?
- what are the frequency settings in the "PV-inverter" assistent? Are the default-settings ok?