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Phoenix Multiplus Compact 12/1600/70 shows lower voltage than measured at terminals

For some reason the sales redirected me to this page - because its a private purchase no chance to get "official" support.It seems everything is locked to the sales chain - no chance for (re)using old stuff in a sustainable way of thinking.

Setup:

I have an Phoenix Multi Compact 12/1600/70 in my camper connected to AC and with 2meters of 35mm² to a CSX12120-BMS120M Battery (LiFePo4).
No significant voltage losses on the battery lines (35mm³@2mtr with currents of 30A in this case)
Of course with main switch and extra fuse (175A) between.

For setup purpose I also have a datalogger running for the battery voltage added (battery terminal voltage) - it takes ~5 second snapshots.

The setup in multi is set to LIFEPO (the default) but with restricted charge current to 30A.(according manual of Battery)

For setup I have MKII and VEConfig running...

Currently the TempSensor is not connected, because the BMS in the Battery is anyway doing a compensation.

All measurements are done with good equipment (UNI T / Rigol scope etc)

DeviceData:
*CMP012162000*
*05100100062*
Phoenix Multi Compact Plus 12/1600/70
On Processor: 1806130.HEX (also shows this in VEConfig)
Small Label: E56394
BigLabel 1A052056 CMP 1216/05100100062

Recognizable Behaviour:

Multi charges battery (with current of 30A as setup) and when internal BMS switches off (~14,5V) measured Voltage increase up to 15,5V
"float" is indicated with blinking yellow LED voltage sits on 16,5V - no current into battery.

When switching on loads on camper (eg. fridge / ~8.5 A) voltage drops shortly down (~1sec)
and charger pushes energy - Current is 8,5A on charger output, but still no current into battery)

All other "channels" work properly just the DC Battery channel is crazy !
This also has effects on the voltage thresholds of Inverter of course...
It switch to early off !

- The manual of battery says that this shall be avoided in means of BMS protection and lifetime.
Also the permanent high voltage @16,5 is not good for the remaining camper electric.

The Question:

Is there a chance to setup the maximum output voltage and make a correction of the additionally ~3V of "overcharging" ?


Would a "manual" battery profile do a better job here ?

Is there a chance for battery sense (by default there is none populated...) ?

Any other "tweaks" to change measuring float voltage ? (Such as calibration)
Anybody else out there with similar effects ?

Greets Daniel




danieldd0 asked
wkirby answered ·

1 Answer

What is the difference between Blue Smart Charger ip22 12/20 (3) 230 Volt and Rev2

In the Victron Connect app i see in the demo library two versions of the charger.

What is the difference between Blue Smart Charger ip22 12/20 (3) 230 Volt and Rev2 Blue Smart Charger ip22 12/20 (3) 230 Volt?

-hans asked
Matthias Lange - DE answered ·

1 Answer

Major Boat Mods

Buying a boat with

1. Two 24/5000 Multiplis inverters

2. 8 230ah 24v house batteries

3. 2 230ah starter batteries

4. 4 230ah thruster batteries

5. 5 solar panels with moot controller

6. 22.5kw Onan

7. 13.5kw Onan

8. 50AMP Shorepower

9. 5 single phase chillers


I want to retire the boat so that everything is on inverters and generators and shore power will be used for charging only. Any recommendations on how to do this? I can multiple methods But would like some advice. I must also mention I have international cruising aspirations so wide ranges of voltage input should be considered. I also want to charge as fast as possible. Engine alternators are also NOT charging house bank but I think they should. Goal is as little generator time as possible.

Ryan

ryan-leestma asked
trevor-bird answered ·

6 Answers

Charger stuck in absorption phase

I've just got a BSC 12/25 charger and have connected it to a new LiFePO4 330AH battery. It took about 8 hours in bulk to get to 14.2V then went into absorption phase as expected. 20 hours later it's still in absorption, has not gone to float. The app shows an interrupted charge cycle and an active one of a few minutes - keeps resetting the time. Is the charger faulty? Firmware is up to date.


The charger has not been disconnected or powered off since first connected.


[image]

Clyde Stubbs asked
Clyde Stubbs answered ·

3 Answers

Split phase victron quarrto 3000/48 not charging from AC

Hello, I hope someone out there can help.

the system in question is installed on a bus with Solar but currently located in a very shaded area, from time to time we need to charge from grid.

the system has a Cerbo GX.

also in setup we disabled "Switch as Group". As suggested in other posts. As we are triying to charge from a single 120V ac input (AC Input 1)

Additionally it is in VS it is setup to start charging from ac when battery voltage drops below a 56 volts.(condition was met).

when connecting to grid, it shows volts and hertz but doesn’t start charging.

Other info:

There’s a CAN bus BMS connected and it controls solar charging perfectly.

I’ll be glad to provide any other data.

Thanks!


chenirl asked
Alexandra commented ·

0 Answers

please can any one know why charge relay turns off too soon ?

Charger Safety relay and the Charge Enable relay this means that the charge current limit (CCL) might be hitting 0A causing the relay to latch OFF. but what should I do to resolve the issue it's charging for just 5 mint and turning off and I restart the BMS and 5 mint again ...

dris-eec asked
Alexandra commented ·

0 Answers

Right 230V charger for Lithium battery with BMS

Hi

I’m currently planning the electrical design for my camper van and it looks as follows:

  • My battery is a 12V 100Ah Lithium Smart battery (LiFePO4)
  • Orion DC-DC charger is used to charge the battery from the alternator
  • MPPT 75/15 is used to charge the battery from the solar panel
  • Battery protect is used to disconnect DC Loads
  • Phoenix inverter is used for 230V loads
  • smallBMS should disconnect chargers or loads independently

Now there are two 230V chargers i could use. I already got the Phoenix IP43 230V charger, because it has an remote on/off switch which can be connected to the BMS. There is also the Blue Smart charger which can also revive dead batteries, but it has no remote on/off connection. So it would require a Cyrix-Li, if I got it right?

The question now is if my setup in general looks ok and which 230V charger fits better. I don’t really understand the differences between them except IP rating and the ability to revive dead batteries.

schreda asked
schreda edited ·

0 Answers

Shore power charging issues

We are plugged into shore power (60hz) and my chargers are not charging in bulk mode.

My charging system: Skylla IP65, 2x. Multiplus 12/3000/120. Solar is providing very little 200watts.

The battery SOC is at 74%. When I turned on the Skyllas one goes into bulk mode the other storage mode. The Multiplus is in float. Shouldn't all the charges go into bulk mode at this SOC?


Batteries are LiFePO4.

tgr23 asked
tgr23 answered ·

2 Answers

Charge disconnect BMS to 1200w inverter charger connection question

Are they referring to the large positive battery connection post? Underlined below at the last sentence

Cable for Smart BMS CL 12-100 to MultiPlus (PN: ASS070200100)

This cable will allow the MultiPlus 500VA – 1600VA, MultiPlus Compact 800VA – 2kVA and MultiPlus-II models to be used with BMS products that have no VE.Bus interface, such as the Smart BMS CL 12-100 and the smallBMS. These MultiPlus models can be controlled from the Load/Charge Disconnect outputs and Load/Charger outputs respectively.

The cable must be wired to the remote on/off connector of the MultiPlus models:

• When used with the MultiPlus 500VA-1200VA models connect the black wire to the ON terminal and the red wire to the (+) terminal.

out-to-sea asked
Stefanie answered ·

1 Answer

IP65 won't charge battery but MPPT 50/100 does

I would like to start with just giving some background on my situation (and that I have checked the other posts on why the BSC IP65 won't charge), and if my situation is the same (bad battery) and what the cause might be.

TLDR; I'm a novice and have not made this setup myself. IP65 stopped charging battery last week but my MPPT 100/50 does. I'm wondering if the company that made the installation has done something wrong which has caused damage to my battery and I now need a new one.

The full story (and sorry that it is long, but I really need help and doing my best to explain what's happened):

I bought a wagon home last year, and with it came one solar panel at 200W, connected to a Sunwind AGM 260Ah battery through a MPPT 75/15, plus an IP65 12V/25A charger, connected at the same time. Never had any issues, both displayed the same battery state, etc. When there was plenty of sun, the MPPT would charge the battery even though the IP65 was connected at the same, and so on. No complaints or issues.

Then during spring, as compensation for delays, and a lot of other issues with my new home, plus that the MPPT didn't provide enough amp to start an electrical devices they had connected to it, I got it upgraded to three 200W solar panels, same battery (AGM 260Ah), new MPPT 100/50, plus the same IP65 12V/25A charger and a SmartBMV 712. They also installed an 3000W inverter, so that I could use the solar power for my TV and some other 220V appliances.

First thing I noticed after the company had made the installation was that when both the MPPT and IP65 was connected was that it would show different status for the battery while charging. The MPPT would display FLOAT, while the IP65 would display ABSORPTION, and charge the battery, while almost no charge came from the MPPT, even though it was sunny outside.

I thought this is weird, but since I don't know much of this, and the company that made the installation said that's normal, I thought okay, I guess I have to trust them it's supposed to be that way. I even spoke to some representative at Victron in Finland who said that nothing can be done about that. Here are two screenshots I took from back then, after the update, during a sunny day:

[image]

[image]

I just thought it was weird that it had worked fine before, no issues getting a charge from the MPPT even though the IP65 was connected (plus both showed the same state), and now with the new MPPT and extra panels, I get almost no charge from the solar panels.

So I came up with a work-around, which was that I set the IP65 behind a timer, so that it would be turned off during day time, and get turned on for the nights. And I think it has worked really well, though I don't know if that might have caused some of my issues.

Then last week, the power was out one night so the IP65 wouldn't charge the battery, and it went down to around 11.21V during the night. Then next day, the MPPT started charging it again. I checked the IP65 during the afternoon, and now when I started it, it would do the TEST, BULK (for a few seconds) and then go straight to ABS, without charging the battery.

The MPPT though managed to charge the battery to full power next day, and keeps on doing it. On the meter though, the light BULK/ABS/FLOAT (respectively) does blink every 3 seconds, which according to the manual (I think) either in BULK mode means it can't charge (which it does), or in FLOAT mode means "Charger temperature too high" (not sure this is correct though, since it blinks every 3 seconds and the manual doesn't say if it should be constant blinking, or if it's the same as blinking once every 3 seconds).

For the MPPT the max charge current is 50A, which I understand shouldn't be too much for a 260Ah battery, i.e. 260/5=52, but if both the IP65 and MPPT would be connected at the same time, and provide charge, it could go over this value - unless there is some function built-in to prevent this (I saw something about this in one other post regarding combining the IP65 and an MPPT).

So summary: Right now the MPPT charges the battery, but the IP65 seems to indicate with that short BULK phase the battery has reached its end of life.

So what has gone wrong with this? The battery has been in use since about October last year, and for the first 6 months, before the new MPPT and the extra solar panels, it was not in use much, only for some LED lights, water pump, etc.

After the upgrade, with the inverter, it's been in use daily. I did read that the AGM battery I have is not made for constant use, so has all the use in past two months killed the battery? Or is there something else going on here? (I've been thinking of upgrading the battery to a better AGM with more Ah anyway, but I need to know if the company that made installation has done something wrong, so I can get compensation from them, or if this "somehow" is my own fault, because I've been using the battery daily, with the inverter, for my TV, etc. I'd like to add that during this two month period, there was also three weeks I was away traveling so the battery wasn't in use for anything else than my mini fridge, which uses about 150W. I.e. the battery has been in constant use for about 6-7 weeks.)

The company also advised me to set the MPPT Load output Operation mode to "Always on".

Here are some screenshots from the Victron app, how it looks currently:

[image]

[image]

[image]

Any advice is highly appreciated. Thanks.

Sami Sin asked
Sami Sin commented ·

1 Answer

Vicrton Energy VE.Direct LoRaWAN - kein Gerät in der Geräteliste (Solar Charger)

Hallo

ich habe das Vicrton Energy VE.Direct LoRaWAN Gerät besorgt und wollte es zum Datenauslesen für den Solar Charger 100/30 verwenden. Ich habe die Anweisung zur Installation befolgt, es dauert gute 20 Minuten bis die LED "grün" blinkt. Die Anmeldung im Portal ging dann ebenfalls. Nun kann ich aber kein Gerät hinzufügen. Bei einer anderen Installation ging das reibungslos.

Ich sehe nur das Gateway und bin der Meinung, dass grundlegende Daten wie Signalstärke usw. auch fehlen:

[image]


[image]

Ich hatte es zwei mal probiert und auch mit einem anderen Charger 75/15. Immer erfolglos.

Habe ich irgendeine Einstellung übersehen/vergessen.

Vielen Dank für die Unterstützung

Gruß

Sören

contrivancer asked

0 Answers

Wiring 3 parallel batteries with IP22 w/3 outputs

Hi,

I have a smaller motorboat with 3 parallel batteries. 1 starter and 2 consumer batteries.
I have bought an IP22 Blue Smart with 3 outputs, and I wonder how to connect them to the charger correctly.

I have made an figure of how I suppose is the correct way, but I am unsure if it really is that simple?
Should I add fuses on any of the wires?

Thanks a lot in advance for your support.

BR - Pjet Barn

pjetbarn asked
dolphins commented ·

4 Answers

Uneven number of Panels

Hi,

Thanks to @Seb71 help I clarified that I need a new mppt charger for my Balcony setup.

For optical reasons ++. I got them very cheap I have exactly 7 panels with VoC of 22V and Vmpp of 18V (150W). Additionally the panels will be vertical (again optical reason), so will probably only give around 60% of Efficiency. One panel will be in shadow 50% of the time.

I actually wanted to have a parallel setup of 4 panels (including the one in shadow) and 3 panels (the ones only in the sun) in series. After some reading this seems to be idiotic / not working.

What kind of split would you prefer? I am honestly a little bit lost..

  1. 3/3 and ignore the 7th one (only optical) would barely reach the battery voltage of 54V (VPPmax 18V*3 = 54..)
  2. 7 in series would be very expensive (mppt 250 required..)
  3. 3 with mppt 100/20 and 4 with mppt 150/30 gives the same problem as (1)

[image]

Thanks for any hint,

Timo


PS: Initial plan was to connect all to a growatt mic 600 (which Has very high max. voltage). I now wanted to evaluate if I can include the Balcony in my normal setup.

techmuc asked
seb71 commented ·

2 Answers

Different smartsolar or use the same?

Hi all,

Probably stupid question but anyhow: Currently I have a smartsolar 250/60 mc4 (2x Mc4 input). This is connected to 2x4 panels (49V Voc, 10A Iac) using both input mc4.

I want to add 4 completely different panels to my balcony now (150W, 22 VoC, 9A).

How can I achieve that best?

  1. Buy a new smartsolar 100/20 and connect it to the same battery as the 250/60? (will that even work and respect the 50A load restrictions of my pylontech?)
  2. Buy a Y mc4 connector and connect my current panels parallel outside of the smartsolar, and use the second mc4 port of my existing smartsolar for the new Balcony panels? (will that affecty current panels?)

I guess the first one is correct but I am really not sure about connecting completely different smartsolars..as per https://www.victronenergy.com/media/pg/VE.Smart_Networking/en/synchronised-charging---further-details.html I would suspect I have to do nothing, but really want to be sure here..

Thanks a lot,

Timo

techmuc asked
seb71 commented ·

1 Answer

Orion-Tr Smart DC-DC 12/24-15 for charging

Hi,

Can I use a Orion-Tr Smart DC-DC 12/24-15 for charging a 24v battery with a 12v input? Or will it only work in Supply mode, converting 12v to 24v?

Best regards,

Joel

Joel Nordahl asked
Sarah edited ·

1 Answer

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