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Pylontech UP5000 not charging to 100%

Good afternoon all,

This is the first time I am using the pylontech UP5000 batteries and I cant get them to charge above 86%, or more specifically 51.53V. The system is a Cerbo, a Quattro, and the pylontech batteries.

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This is not my first time setting up a Victron with the Pylontech batteries, and I thought it was pretty straightforward up until now.


I have been through https://www.victronenergy.com/live/battery_compatibility:pylontech_phantom

and all of my settings are exactly as they state here, with the exception of the DVCC.

It looks like the items on the Live page are outdated as the DVCC is now forced on. SVS is forced off, STS is forced off. (I have checked past installations and I see this is now true on all my installations)

In addition to the above the following settings are set:

Limit charge current: Off

Limit managed battery charge voltage: off

SCS : off.

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I also have confirmed the battery and the Cerbo are communicating with the parameters coming through as expected. The BMS CAN is set up correctly and I have no errors.

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Additionally, I see that the cell data is now available. I don't know if this is just a Cerbo thing or a UP5000 thing. But I think it's cool.

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History:

When I first charged the battery it charged to 100%, which was at 51.53V. Over time that 100% has dropped to 86%.

What I suspect is that overtime the cells have balanced, which causes the 51.53V to equal a lower SOC. This is just my opinion and could be incorrect.

I dont know if anyone has any ideas on what I can do differently, or if I am missing anything. as at this point, I don't know how to get it to charge to 100%.

ewalderasmus asked
agroventuresperu commented ·

6 Answers

Victron ESS battery compatibility Pylontech US5000(B)

Hello, I've found some threads regarding compatibility of the Pylontech US5000 battery (not the UP) with the Victron ESS system but a lot of them seem to be mixing up the UP and the US version.

The exact battery type (US5000 or US5000B, see https://en.pylontech.com.cn/pro_detail.aspx?id=134&cid=23 ) is currently not listed on the battery compatibility list of Victron (https://www.victronenergy.com/live/battery_compatibility:pylontech_phantom)


At this point, I'm assuming it's compatible, but I'd prefer a formal confirmation of this.

Even better: would it be possible to update the documentation page with compatible battery types? During certification of the electrical system by a notified body, some inspectors are pretty specific about the compatibility, certified by the vendor of the ESS, between a BMS and the ESS system.

At this point, I don't have the documentation (or certificates) ready to back this up.

axl1988 asked
Guy Stewart (Victron Community Manager) answered ·

3 Answers

Multiplus 2 48/5000 with Pylontech US5000

Hi all

Just looking at getting my ESS project underway and obviously want to get started asap. Just a quick question. The recommended battery for the 48/5000 is 200 to 800 amp. I believe the US5000 is only 100amp but it does meet the requirement for surge current when starting up. Therefore, is it ok to or did anyone else start with just 1 * US5000 on this inverter and build the system up by adding another battery approx. 3 months later. Solar generation is going to reduce in the UK shortly so the single 4.8kw battery would be enough for take the excess solar until the spring

Thanks

Simon

simon-jukes asked
simon-jukes answered ·

3 Answers

Pylontech CCL and DCL well below specified maximum Charge Current

I have several Pylontech UP5000 installations, from 5KVAh to 40 KVAh. What I see is that I can never achieve maximum charge/discharge current specified, because CCL and DCL limits them. This happens not only at a certain temperature or when batteries are achieving maximum or minimum SOC%. That could be understandable. But an UP5000 has a 50 Amps standard charging specs and also a 0,7C for 5 minutes, 0,89 C for 60 seconds and a 2C for 15 seconds. Also there is info of lifecycle impact when you charge or discharge batteries to more than 0,5C. Bute I cannot achieve anything more than 0,5C CCL or DSL. I don´t believe BMS is allowing that. At least I coudn´t achieve those specs. Do you know if those limits can be changed? Even at owner decision to reduce SOH of batteries.

Also noticed in in article: https://www.victronenergy.com/live/battery_compatibility:pylontech_phantom#the_maximum_charge_and_discharge_current_is_limited_to_25a_but_the_data_sheet_tells_me_the_maximum_is_100a
In Hardware protection points states, within 5.3 chapter:
"Over-charge and Over-discharge Current Limit 102A for 15 seconds, 200A for 0.1 seconds and 400A short circuit current." So seems that these limits are able to be achieved. But are they working while CCL and DCL limits far below them.?



mito asked
Alexandra commented ·

3 Answers

Building three phase ESS with Multiplus 5kW and Pylontech

Hi,


I am planning to install a ESS system according to the simplified schematic below combining 3 x Multiplus 5000VA for timeshifting energy and occasional backup duty. I hope I have gotten it right!


So my questions are,

1. What is the minimum battery requirement with Pylontech US2000 Plus batteries for this system? The Victron guide on Pylontech only covers off grid use which is more demanding compared to ESS. A breakdown of the requirement would also really help so I can think for myself next time :) Inrush currents have been mentioned before but I cannot find any numbers to base my decision on.

2. Can I add more US2000 Plus modules several years later even if they have different state of health?

3. Can I add other battery types in the same installation?


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Regards,

Sven F

s-forsberg asked
nickdb commented ·

5 Answers

Display of net values not available in Cerbo GX

I have a setup out of:
- 3 MP II 5000 in 3 Phase config
- 8 Pylontech US3000C in ESS config
- DC Coupled PV with 2 Victron MPPTs
- AC Coupled PV with 10 Year old Kostal on the “AC IN” Side of the Multiplus
- Nothing connected on AC Output
- Cerbo GX Device
- Local Monitoring with Influx & Grafana
- EM24 Ethernet as Net Meter


Complete System works as expected. ESS, Feed excess energy, loading, regulating to 0 consumption… everything fine for Month now. But since the beginning, the GX does not show the net values from the net meter. Values in MQTT and the Monitoring are perfectly fine. I always wondered why? See pictures. Any idea why?

Expectation was that is displays the Net values (directly the values from the EM24) in the red box. The "Ac-Load" (Green box) of course is wrong values, because this system does not know what is load and what is from the AC Solar system.

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solarlion asked
solarlion edited ·

0 Answers

Pylontech battery cable spec

Hello,


Can someone please clarify the following:


The Pylontech 2m external power cables (both + and -) is labelled 4AWG. The Pylontech US3000 manual (page 12) rates this as a 120A cable. AWG 4 translates to a 21.2mm2 cable with a current carrying capability of 70A at 60 deg C. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/American_wire_gauge)


A Pylontech US3000 battery (page 4 of manual) has recommended charge/discharge capacity of 37 A. This cable should work fine with a single module. However 2 modules in parallel will double the current capacity while voltage remain at 48V. Are we really using a 70A cable on a 74 A supply source? Obviously the max current per single US3000 is much higher.

The Pylontech cables does not appear to be a copper cable. The wire strands are silver.



Thank you

Jean

jeanmc asked
cristimv commented ·

8 Answers

Simple grid connected Multiplus ii 48/10000 and Pylontech battery storage system - No PV

Hi, having taken earlier advice I am now the proud owner of a Multiplus ii 48/10000, 4x Pylontech US500C batteries circa 19kwh, Cerbo GX, Cerbo GX Touch 50, Current sensing transformer and and this week my electrical supply has switched to EDF GoElectric 35 which gives me 5hrs low rate overnight.

Our house is fully electric and is split economy 7 style.

Night loads such as storage heating/immersion heater being fed from the switched smart meter 5th terminal for 5hrs on low rate overnight. I want to leave this unchanged and is working perfectly.

All other loads are fed from the 24hr smart meter 4th terminal which is both high and low rate depending on the time of the day/night. My EV charger is connected to this and want to continue with this being supplied direct from the grid and not from my batteries, so my understanding is I need to effect changes downstream of this connection.

My simple 24hr use case is

1. Charge batteries overnight during the 5hrs low rate as well as continuing to power all loads. The multiplus 48/10000 invertor is sized to be able to charge my batteries during the 5hrs as long as I keep the batteries above 10degC.

2. When low rate is switched off, use the batteries to power house loads via the multiplus with the grid providing additional power as needed to meet peaks or pick up when the batteries are depleted and awaiting the next overnight charge cycle. By my calcs the multiplus / pylontech combination is able to provide circa 4.8kw but will probably limit this to below 3.6kw. My house peaks at circa 8kw on occasion so I will need to draw circa 4.4kw from the grid in addition to the batteries supply for short periods.

I am pretty confident that my purchases can be configured to do all this, but I am struggling to find a definitive way connect everything and was thinking there must be. I do not intend to fit solar due to poor roof orientation.

I would be most grateful if someone can point me in the direction of a detailed diagram that I can use as a starter.

thank you in advance.


netzerodude asked
nickdb commented ·

3 Answers

Fronius disconnect loop (Quattro in ESS and Pylontech batteries)

Hello,

I have a Fronius Primo 8.2-1 connected to two Quattros 48/5000/70-2x100 running in parallel. In addition, we have two SmartSolar MPPT 250-100 chargers and a mix of Pylontech US2000, US3000 and US3000C (12 batteries in total - with the US3000C as masters and the rest as slaves, with three 120A rated cables going from the Lynx to the batteries, distributed as equally as possible).
The Fronius is connected to AC OUT 1, setup is MG50 and in ESS the frequencies are as recommended by Victron: Start 50.2 Hz, Minimum 52.7Hz, Disconnect 53.0.

In Venus, under Pylontech battery, the parameters are identified as follows: Charge Voltage Limit 53.2, Charge and Discharge Current Limit 335.0 A.

[image]


When there is enough sun, I get 10kW from the two SmartSolar chargers and around 6kW from the Fronius. Problem can be spotted in this graph, usually at ~11kW sent to the Pylontech batteries (anything above 220A for more than 10 seconds), the Victron raises the frequency and the Fronius gets disconnected with error 105 (too high frequency). The Victron then drops the frequency back to 50Hz, Fronius spends some time and does its checks and after a while its connected again, rinse and repeat.


When there is high load on the house, the Victron leaves the Fronius to work at its full potential, sustaining 5.5-6kW for as long as there is enough sun. So my guess is that the reason for this behavior is somewhere between Victron and Pylontech.

Does someone have an idea why this is happening, what can we test and do to solve this?

Thanks in advance.

Kitaigorod Alexandru asked

0 Answers

Pylontech US5000 availability in Europe?

Does any dealer in Europe list the Pylontech US5000 as in stock? I've seen sites that keep constatly pushing their availability date forward.

Juha Tuomala asked

0 Answers

Is a Turbo Energy By PylonTech considered a Pylontech 3000 or 3000C or 3000B ?

Hi everyone,

As the BMS Can Cable for connecting the Cerbo to a pylontech battery can be of version A or B depending of it is respectively a 3000C or 3000, I would like to know what version is the Turbo energy by pylontech battery of 3.5kwh: 3000C, 3000 or even 3000B as this page is suggesting: https://prismsolar.co.uk/product/pylontech-us3000b-3-5-kwh-li-ion-battery-module-48v/

If it is a 3000B what cable should be used the cable A or B. If it the wrong cable, would there be no reading at all or inaccurate reading?


Thank you for your help, this is so important.

Here a picture of my battery:

photo_2022-05-04_18-44-32.jpg


michaeltenerife asked
ramblinglamb answered ·

4 Answers

Pylontech low charge current (charges just on one phase)

Hi,

I do have following Setup:

  • 3x MultiPlus-II 48/3000/35-32 configured as 3 phase system (multiphase regulation set to "sum of all phases" )
  • 3x Pylontech US3000C as battery bank
  • Solar AC coupled 5.5kw peak on phase L1 (old system from 2012 limited to 4kw max output)

The Problem now is that the Pylontech batteries are only charged with about 32A from the Multiplus on phase L1. Maximum i have seen was 35A. The other 2 inverters seem to not charge the battery. This then results in lot of excess solar still feed into the grid instead of the battery. Discharging however works fine. Then all 3 Multiplus activate and discharge with about up to 110A maximum.


The charge current limit of the battery says 111A in the cerbo gx as you can see in the picture. So that cant be the problem. Also as a test I change the ac solar from L1 to L2. Then only the Multiplus on L2 charges the battery. Is this problem maybe some kind of configuartion issue ?


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marc-mcfly asked
marc-mcfly answered ·

2 Answers

SmartSolar 150/100 not producing more than 2600W in a 48V system

Hi everybody,

I'm adressing this excellent community with the hope it'll help me solve a problem I've run into recently with my Victron off-grid solar installation.


First of all, the components:


12x 390W 144 half-cell solar panels, wired in 6 parallel groups of 2 in series panel.jpg

1x SmartSolar 150/100 MC4 MPPT (v. 1.59) mppt.jpg

1x Quattro 48/8000/110-2x100 (v. 4.30) inverter.jpg

1x ColorControl GX (v. 2.89) ccgx.jpg

3x PylonTech US3000C 48V Lithium Batteries battery.jpg


Up until now I'm incredibly happy with the setup, everything runs smoothly, I also have a small petrol backup generator I haven't had to use since 2020 wired to one of the AC inputs of the Quattro.


Now for the problem:

Recently I installed a pump for the well, which connects to a VFD regulating startup and some filters, everything wired to the AC output of the Quattro. The pump draws continuous 5000W of power. This has brought a problem to light which I had never noticed before:

The MPPT never draws more than 2600W from the panels! Or to be more specific, and this is what REALLY bugs me, it never draws more than a value that seems to be around the Charge Current Limit multiplied by the Maximum Battery Voltage; in terms of the solar array an interval centered around 33A at 75V. pumprun.jpg

Since the Pylontech batteries have their integrated BMS I can't really manipulate any values, all I can tell is that the CCL declared by the batteries is 44A, and the DCL is 111A (or 37A times 3 units, exactly the numbers from the manual). DVCC is activated with all sharings turned off, and the MPPT is running in networked mode as a Slave.

Now, I've checked and double checked, but at this point I think I'm going crazy. From what I understand, in 48V systems, shouldn't the SmartSolar 150/100 be able to produce up to 5800W (as per the datasheet)? Ideally, what I thought would happen, is that the MPPT would draw as much power as possible from the panels, and then "fill up" the remainder from battery power. What is actually happening is quite the opposite, the MPPT only draws up to the 2600W mentioned before and all of the remaining power is drawn from the batteries. During the day and with the panels in full sunlight and at a temperature of around 30ºC this seems quite stupid, as the battery capacity quickly becomes a bottleneck for the amount of time I can run the pump. What am I doing/understanding wrong?

The only thing I haven't tried yet is setting a limit for the charge current in the DVCC. Might this be the crucial point? How is point 4 in subject 8.4.1 in this link to be interpreted? And point 5?

https://www.victronenergy.com/media/pg/CCGX/en/dvcc---distributed-voltage-and-current-control.html


Any help is welcome! Thanks a lot in advance for any hints or ideas!

Ventura López Kalász asked
Ventura López Kalász commented ·

3 Answers

When I power the Cerbo GX from the US3000C, (with the Multiplus-2 3000 switched off), the GX boots, but the US3000C is not on the device list.

I am adding a US3000C to an existing single US3000, which worked fine.

The existing system was connected with a CAN Type B wire. The US3000C needs a CAN Type A wire. I made an adapter, which I added to the Type B wire with a 1-to-1 LAN connector. I have tested the Type B wire and the adapted Type A wire with a LAN tester, and they are OK.

Because it didn't work, I disconnected the second battery (US3000) so that only the US3000C was connected, but not recognised.

As a check, I disconnected the US3000C and connected just the old US3000,which was recognised. I connected the CAN (type B) cable via the 1-to-1 LAN adapter and a 1-to-1 LAN cable, and it still was recognised. What I'm saying is, I don't think there is a fault in the CAN cable.

I updated the Cerbo GX firmware to the latest version (2.84) but still not recognised.

autoroamer asked
mattsmith commented ·

2 Answers

Firmware clashes with Cerbo and Pylon US3000C

Hi there Folks

Please can someone from Victron look into this for us - There is a definite issue with a firmware clash between the Pylon US3000C batteries and Cerbo GX - its literally a coin toss every time you do an installation ( if the cerbo it will pick up the Pylon battery) I've seen the only thing that "kickstarts" the comms again, is if you connect a ccgx to the installation. once it picks up the pylon on the ccgx, you can reconnect the comms cable to the cerbo again and then it will run fine - until the Cerbo resets or powers down. then you have to go out to site again ccgx in hand and kickstart the setup again... I have 4 sites running like this and is a huge concern.


Some other issues we recently encountered was the Solar Production from Smartsolar chargers lags at 100w for long portions of the day while trying to get to active SOC level

Ben Graham van der Sandt asked
mattsmith answered ·

1 Answer

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