question

kyaw-thu avatar image
kyaw-thu asked

How to solve cell unbalanced problem for US2000 Pylontech batteries?

Dear Victron Energy Community members,

I have an off-grid solar system with 1 Victron Quattro 48/15000 Inverter, 1 Venus GX, 1 Pylontech battery hub, 3 Victron MPPT chargers and 25 Pylontech US2000 batteries.

I have installed this system since July 2020 on the mobile clinic boat. (Irrawaddy River Doctors Youtube link )

The boat is a non-profit NGO mobile clinic boat ( named as Irrawaddy River Doctors Mobile Clinic ) that provides health care to people living in villages with difficult access to health in the delta of Myanmar. (Foundation Web Page link)

In the past the boat used 32nos 12V 200Ah AGM batteries and 48v5000W CyberPower inverter and in July 2020 Victron Inverter, new Solar Panels and Pylontech batteries were replaced and installed.

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After installing it, there was an Internal alarm, but I was able to use it without any other problems.

However, in March 2023, High Voltage and Low Voltage alarms appeared and even at SOC 80%, the inverter became a shutdown problem.


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Therefore, I checked the condition of the battery. I noticed that SOC display leds were not the same with each other.

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Then I checked the batteries using battery viewer software and the answers are as follows...


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I found that most of the batteries had cell imbalance problems and about two batteries had communication problems.

That problem can not be resolved until now and the battery's performance is further degraded.

Therefore, I submit the measurement results and data. I hope to provide technical support and how to solve the problem as soon as possible.


With best regard,


BMSPylontechovervoltage
3 comments
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dayandnight avatar image dayandnight commented ·

Hello @Kyaw Thu

I would like to try to help.

Unfortunately, I can't see a single graphic or a single image in your post. None of your links work either. It all looks like the following screen-shot.

victron-forum-01.jpg

I suspect something went wrong when creating the post and importing or linking the graphics.

Servus - DayAndNight

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snoobler avatar image snoobler dayandnight commented ·
Same for me.



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kyaw-thu avatar image kyaw-thu snoobler commented ·
Dear @snoobler ,

Thank you so much for your response.

It may be due to my poor internet connection.

Now I made it as a PDF file and can you check and help me.

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5 Answers
kyaw-thu avatar image
kyaw-thu answered ·

Dear @DayAndNight ,

Thank you so much for your response.

It maybe due to my internet poor connection.

Now I made it as PDF and you could check and help to me.

Batteries SOC Measurement Result ( 1_3_2023 ).pdf

How to solve cell unbalanced problem for US2000 Pylontech batteries.pdf


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Matthias Lange - DE avatar image Matthias Lange - DE ♦ commented ·
You should try to make a slow full charging with a lower current and slightly reduced voltage (increase the voltage in small steps at the end).

This will take some hours or maybe days.

This should balance the cells and you should do that regularly to prevent that from happen again.

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kyaw-thu avatar image kyaw-thu Matthias Lange - DE ♦ commented ·

Dear @Matthias Lange - DE ,

Thank you so much for your suggestions.

So, do I remove the battery from the battery group?

Shall I do that charging with an external charger?

How much lower current should it be for one battery?

It will be a long time because I have to do 25 batteries, so how do I save time?

Should I balance the cells regularly monthly? or how can I decide?

Do I need to upgrade BMS firmware for US2000?


Please advise me..

with best regards

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dayandnight avatar image
dayandnight answered ·

Hello @Kyaw Thu ,

I already had a strategy in mind for you, but then it occurred to me that you are probably really 100% OFF-GRID on the ship and in pure island mode.

Nevertheless, one thing is important for me to explain. You can charge one or more Pylontech batteries with an external charger at any time and bring them into a defined state of 100% SOC.

I use a JOY-IT laboratory power supply for this purpose, which is also intended for charging rechargeable batteries and has a special plus-pole connection for this purpose. I set the voltage on this charger to 53.2 V and use e.g. 2.0 A as the current. If you use it to charge the Pylontech battery, it is controlled by the battery technology and the internal BMS of the Pylontech.

You don't have to worry about the current and voltage value. Since I deviate from the explanation of @Matthias Lange - DE . This means that the fuller the battery becomes, the less power the battery will consume. The current will decrease to a few mA and sometimes the BMS will even switch the battery to "IDLE". You can see this by the fact that all LEDs on the Pylontech go out and only the RUN LED flashes from time to time. You can also track and monitor all of this via the batteryview. As far as I understand it, in the 100% SOC state, the BMS will also balance the individual cells in the battery to each other. But that can take some time. It will all work without you ever having to change the preset amperage or voltage.

With such a procedure, you could pre-charge individual Pylontech batteries to almost 100%. If your complete stack then reaches 100% SOC again from the sun, you could re-integrate the pre-charged batteries into the stacks.

I'm just not sure if you have the appropriate charging technology and as someone who runs his house in island mode ( as a luxury problem) and always has mains available, I find it easy for me because I can switch to mains operation at any time. All things that are probably not or only with difficulty possible for you.

I thought about the following while writing and what do you think of this proposal.

Combine all functioning batteries with matching SOCs. During this time period, there may not be 5 stacks with 5 batteries, but only 4 stacks with 5 batteries or 5 stacks with 4 batteries or similar combinations.

Then you should take care of the problem batteries separately. I am truly convinced that many or even all can be brought back to a perfectly working condition.

I just checked your table. It also looks like you're getting 100% SOC with no issues.

soc-tab.jpg

I think the condition actually looks good. Only the batteries A1, A2, B1, B2, E1 E2 seem to cause problems for whatever reason.

The SOC81% column means that in this state you are shown a total SOC of 81% and then you read out the individual batteries with batteryview and then listed them in the table?

That would strengthen my suspicion that one, some or all of these six problem batteries are messing everything up in terms of the overall SOC. As a test, I would make five stacks of three batteries each from the 19 good batteries and then see how the whole system behaves and balances itself

If everything is going well and balanced, the next step would be to re-integrate the most promising A1 battery and the remaining four good batteries into the stacks and operate and monitor five stacks, each with four batteries.

I would subject the remaining batteries to individual treatment, later.

How old are the batteries? Maybe you also have a guarantee about Pylontech? Have you already checked that?

Kind Regard - DayAndNight


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kyaw-thu avatar image kyaw-thu commented ·

Dear @DayAndNight ,

I apologize for my late response. I will answer your some questions.

Que; Nevertheless, one thing is important for me to explain. You can charge one or more Pylontech batteries with an external charger at any time and bring them into a defined state of 100% SOC.

Ans; I can charge just one by one with an external charger and bring them into a defined state of proximity SOC100% but it will take a long time because for about 25 batteries.

Que; How old are the batteries? Maybe you also have a guarantee about Pylontech? Have you already checked that?

Ans; The batteries are nearly 3 years old because I installed them in June 2020. I don't have a guarantee about Pylontech because this guarantee process is difficult for me ( if you are able to do it, you could help me).

Thank you so much for your many suggestions and it will help me.

Firstly, I will try to do as @ponzoa 's cell balancing suggests because it will save time for me.

Secondly, I will try to charge it with an external charger.

You could advise me on this process.


with best regard,

Kyaw Thu from Myanmar.




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ponzoa avatar image
ponzoa answered ·

I have some suggestions.

Personally, I believe the cabling is causing you issues. Although the manual shows connecting both extremeties of positive and negative to each parallel array, I ONLY connect one positive at one end, and one negative at the other. This helps to ensure balance. ALL battery cables should be the same length, cross section and resistance.

Try removing the extra positive and negative from each parallel array.

The firmware of each unit should ideally be the same but this is not critical as long as your Master units have the latest versions in their arrays.

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kyaw-thu avatar image kyaw-thu commented ·
Dear @ponzoa ,

Thank you so much for your answer.

I will try as your suggestion and if Master units don't have the latest versions you can help me for firmware?

with best regard,

Kyaw Thu


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kevgermany avatar image
kevgermany answered ·

Some really good suggestions above.

Be aware as well that the batteries can only balance internally if they reach a charge close to 100% and remain at that level for sufficient time. If the charge rate is too high with out of balance cells, the batteries can cut out for self protection.

Guessing that you're not regularly charging to 100% and holding them there. But this does not discount the wiring issues suggested above. Could also be a combination of things.

On the environment. It would be worth checking that you're operating within the battery specifications. Hot and humid isn't a good match for any batteries.


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ponzoa avatar image ponzoa commented ·
On another note, I found that the best way to balance Pylontech LV batteries is to connect them all up, turn them on and turn off the inverter. This way, the charge levels balance themselves out amongst each other. You'll know it's done when the lights on the batteries stay off/in stand by mode. Perhaps they've never had a chance to balance from new and they're a bit "all over the place". This, apart from the cabling, should help.
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kyaw-thu avatar image kyaw-thu ponzoa commented ·

Dear @ponzoa ,

I will try your suggestion for the cell balancing process.

with best regard,

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kyaw-thu avatar image kyaw-thu commented ·

Dear @kevgermany ,

Thank you so much for your suggestion. I will note with thanks.

with best regard,

Kyaw Thu

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ponzoa avatar image ponzoa kyaw-thu commented ·
Do let us know how this goes and if you solve the issue.
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sun66 avatar image
sun66 answered ·

Hello,

Thank you for this post which was very interesting. I have a similar issue of unbalanced cells in Pylontech batteries. I also wondered if too unbalanced cells can prevent the battery parc to reach 100% SOC ?

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Pylontechs self balance once charged gets to 90%. They probably won't hit 100% until the balance. And it can take a long time if they're a long way out of balance.

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