question

Doruk Kocuk avatar image
Doruk Kocuk asked

Using more than one temperature sensor.

d94b7375-6498-47d0-b742-7e40d383970e.jpegHi,

In a typical setup, one is allowed to have only one temperature sensor for the battery bank to be charged. All chargers are designed to listen to one single sensor. It makes perfect sense when you have just one battery or two batteries sitting “right next to” each other. But in real life a service/domestic/house bank consists of multiple batteries. In this situation, temperature measurement of all batteries in the bank is not possible. In the attached photo, you see two batteries sitting close to each other. The gap in betwen them is approx 6 cm. While one battery is 87 degrees celcius, the other one is 33. Assume that the temperature sensor was fitted on the one which is 33 degrees. The charger would continue charging without knowing that the other one is 87. This happened to a client of mine which had no temperature sensor and even a charger which has no temperature sensor input. He just had pure lock. I was nearby.


In a lithium setup, bms keeps an eye on each battery’s temperature. So it is obvious that it is possible to handle more than one temperature inputs. But it is not possible to do this in a lead acid setup (or a setup with non-smart batteries).


What can be done so that Victron chargers measure each individual battery in the bank?


Cheers.



battery chargingTemperature Sensortemperature compensation
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6 Answers
Sarah avatar image
Sarah answered ·

Hi @Doruk Kocuk - I am not aware of any way to achieve this at present. The Cerbo GX has the capacity for four temperature sensors but no algorithm to compensate for an average temperature - an interesting (devils in the detail) project for Victron. Perhaps a better solution would be to use temperature based external cooling fans to ensure that all of the batteries are operating at a similar temperature or rearrange the environment surrounding the hotter batteries to compensate. Thinking further it may be that different locations imply different cable sizes/lengths and you are experiencing asymmetrical dis/charging that is loading up one battery. Alternatively if you are referring to DC-DC charging for a starter battery a small trickle charger connected between the house and starter battery may be appropriate. It is also worth noting that while lithium batteries have high and low temperature dis/charge limits they do not typically have temperature based compensation. No immediate fix but some ideas for moving forward.

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Doruk Kocuk avatar image
Doruk Kocuk answered ·

Hi @Sarah

Yes, that would be a great thing to have for Victron. Many boats these days are switching to lithium but for many many years lead acids will be in our lives. It makes sense to stay protected from burning batteries. Using the existing capabilities of Cerbo, only thing I can do is to use multiple sensors in one battery bank to trigger an alarm. All should be fine if the user is available to check his/her emails at the time the alarm goes off. I am sure it would be a great added value to Victron if they do this.


Thanks.

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harold avatar image
harold answered ·

I use the battery temp. sensor, connected to my Quattro.
+ I follow the trend of both battery's (24V system) by 2 Ruuvi's.

I am expecting a possibility to trigger an alarm with also the Ruuvi's in the future ;-)

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rostyvyg avatar image
rostyvyg answered ·

I am in the same predicament. My house bank consists of 4 Victron AGM SuperCycle 170Ah batteries which randomly go into thermal runaway with no rhyme or reason. Once in a while when in absorption one of the batteries starts consuming increasingly more power, heats up, etc. After the battery cools down it might go through multiple charging cycles with no issues and then another battery exhibits the same behavior. And then another one. There is currently no way to give Multiplus an early warning since if the temperature sensor selected as active in DVCC is on the terminal of a nearby battery the overheating battery continues to heat up until it heats the battery with the active sensor at which point the damage has already been done. I installed a temperature sensor on each battery in my boat house bank (4 sensors in total) and connected them to the temperature sensor inputs on CerboGX but there is no way to make CerboGX report to DVCC the temperature of the HOTTEST sensor in this group for temperature compensation while charging. The best I can do is use the CrboGX relay to power up the fans which improves the battery box ventilation and sound the buzzer alarm. This is a ridiculous situation. We have a smart highly programmable device that is supposed to be able to use every available bit of information to make the charging process safer and more efficient but it can't automatically select the temperature of the hottest battery in the charged bank for temperature compensation. Really, Victron?

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Fideri avatar image
Fideri answered ·

Let me add my voice. Because of the very common scenarios described above, I find it weird to be able to connect my temp sensor to just one battery in an entire bank. My previous batteries were fried partly because of this reason. Even in smart Lithiums, the BMS can fail.

Fideri

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rostyvyg avatar image
rostyvyg answered ·

There have been quite a few posts on this forum and all over the internet about overheating AGM batteries (especially Victron SuperCycle batteries) when they are used in parallel configuration. I am surprised no Victron engineer has expressed interest in this problem, especially considering all prerequisites hardware-wise are in place. CerboGX has FOUR temperature sensor inputs which could be used for monitoring individual batteries in the bank and with minimal programming for intelligent temperature reporting to DVCC.

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Related Resources

Victron temperature sensor disambiguation table - which product supports which sensor


VictronConnect VE.Bus charging manual  

Additional resources still need to be added for this topic