question

Carlo avatar image

How can I add a cool down delay on a generator, such as Venus disconnect AC IN 1 when Generator signal is sent to shutdown the generator?

In a system with six(6) Quattros 10K configured in 3Phase and parallel, the backup generator we has a needs of 5 minute cool down period when the generator start signal is removed.

When the Venus relay removes the start signal in relay number 1 the Generator needs to be disconnected from the Quattros, is there a way to have the Quattros Disconnect AC IN 1 so that the generator continues running in its cool down period without load?

FYI we are using ESS, this issue happens when the grid has failed for a long time (days) and generator is turn on for its weekly excessive or when the battery is too low and needs to be charge enough to reach the next solar cycle.

In essence we would like the generator to run without load for a period of 5 minutes after the generator is not needed any more.


thanks

Carlo

MultiPlus Quattro Inverter ChargerVenus GX - VGXGenerator
10 |3000 characters needed characters left characters exceeded

Up to 8 attachments (including images) can be used with a maximum of 190.8 MiB each and 286.6 MiB total.

3 Answers
Mark avatar image
Mark answered ·

I think that you may be able to achieve a 'warm down' (and even a warm up) period by;

1. Physically wiring the GX device relay contacts into the Quattro 'Aux In' contacts

2. Using multiple assistants to;

a) 'Ignore AC Input' during the specified warm up/down period

b) Control a Quattro programmable relay, which can be used to start/stop the generator (generator auto-start connected to the Quattro programmable relay contacts instead of the GX device)


I have not tested this to confirm that it actually works, but this is what I suggest trying;

Wiring - refer to manual;


Assistants Tab


Assistant Summary

The example below should result in a 120s/2min warm up time/delay and 300s/5min warm down time/delay


Programmable Relay (1) Assistant - Step by step example

Select the relay to drive (physical K1/K2 or the 'General Flag' that can be allocated to a purpose in the 'General Flag User' assistant)


Select the relay action


Select the condition(s) to activate the relay action


Configure the condition and trigger delay - 300s/5min delay in this case (for the warm down period)


General Flag User assistant

Used to disconnect the AC input/generator during the warm up/down period


To configure an assistant you need to use a MK3 to USB interface;

https://www.victronenergy.com/accessories/interface-mk3-usb

With VE.Configure software;

https://docs.victronenergy.com/veconfigure.html#warning

You can also use the 'fake target' demo mode in VE.Configure to see what's possible before you configure your real device.

If your not comfortable to do this yourself seek support from a qualified/competent Victron installer or Victron dealer.


1581770227040.png (242.2 KiB)
1581770376616.png (59.4 KiB)
1581770460596.png (90.6 KiB)
1581770484595.png (52.4 KiB)
1581770654437.png (58.5 KiB)
1581770710272.png (40.3 KiB)
1581770724663.png (50.4 KiB)
1581770746181.png (48.2 KiB)
1581770819586.png (41.1 KiB)
1 comment Share
10 |3000 characters needed characters left characters exceeded

Up to 8 attachments (including images) can be used with a maximum of 190.8 MiB each and 286.6 MiB total.

I think this may also work ('AC1 available' used as the condition in 'programmable relay (3)' and should be a little more reliable/accurate with the warm up delay (as it will wait until the generator has started and the Quattro sees AC power at the input before the delay timer commences);

1581772644719.png (52.3 KiB)
Carlo avatar image
Carlo answered ·

Remember that the problem is that even though the VENUS has discontinued the signal to keep the generator running. The generator continius to run for 5 extra minutes in a cooling down state. the Venus if it has decided to discontinue using the generator should also disconnect accepting power via AC IN #1. If it did then the generator would have zero load and would shutdown (cool down) correctly. Also if give time to the Quattros to transition from passthrough (GEN to LOAD) to inverter mode without the jolt of power in the AC IN #1 disappearing.


1 comment Share
10 |3000 characters needed characters left characters exceeded

Up to 8 attachments (including images) can be used with a maximum of 190.8 MiB each and 286.6 MiB total.

Hi @Carlo, I completely understand what you mean, and the benefits - but no we dont have such feature at the moment. sorry.


if required, it will need to be done by using external contactor(s) and time relays

Rob Duthie avatar image
Rob Duthie answered ·

Hi

You could fit a delay timer unit from the start control signal. There are din rail mounted industrial timers, that have multiple inputs to control time functions etc.


Regards

Rob D

NZ


3 comments Share
10 |3000 characters needed characters left characters exceeded

Up to 8 attachments (including images) can be used with a maximum of 190.8 MiB each and 286.6 MiB total.

A time delay would not work, I would have to add a relay to shut down the 3 phase 200A circuit from the generator. I just wanted to know if this could be done with the Quattros since they have such a relay/switch inside.

Hm. Do you have a GX device in there? (I suppose you have in such a larger installation)


There actually might be a way with a little hackery, where the GX would put all Quattros int Inverter Only mode for said 5 minutes.

It's not possible to switch between AC-IN1 and AC-IN2 "manually/on purpose" though. Which is a pity.

1581765664131.png (60.6 KiB)

I went (once again) down the rabbit hole that is Venus OS DBus and

root@ccgx:~# dbus-send --print-reply=literal --system --dest=com.victronenergy.vebus.ttyO1 /Mode com.victronenergy.BusItem.GetValue
   variant       uint32 3

It looks like it's there, so in theory one can hack it. Although ... holy sh*, what sadist is in charge of the DBus system in Venus OS?

a) it's not com.victronenergy.vebus as https://github.com/victronenergy/venus/wiki/dbus suggests, but com.victronenergy.vebus.ttyO1

b) mind you, that ttyO1 is really an O (as in "OOOOH") and not a zero.

Must be some Dutch Linux standard. ;-)