Smart BMS CL 12/100 or Smart BMS 12/200

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nbo asked Jul 7, '23

Smart BMS CL 12/100 or Smart BMS 12/200

I am planning to Exchange the house batteries on our sailboat to lithium. To charge them from the alternator/start battery i want to use the Smart BMS CL 12/100 or the Smart 12/200

Accourding the specs both have an 100a alternator port. Only difference is the system+ port.

where it is not clear for me wat the advantage is?

Does the Smart BMS than also works as an Battery Protect for the lithium side so a additionel battery Protect is not requiered to shut of DC loads to prevent for over discharging.

The diagram in the marine booklet does also nog show a BP

If this assuption is correct it would safe connections and equipment which on a boat is always better.

ps. The intended AC-DC charger is the Phoenix Smart IP43. Other Solution is to build it with a small BMS and Orion Dc-Dc charger.

Lithium Battery BMS Phoenix Smart Charger ip43

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Stefanie (Victron Energy Staff) answered · Jul 07, 2023 at 06:20 AM

Hi @Nbo,

Only difference is the system+ port. where it is not clear for me wat the advantage is?

The advantage is that you can connect loads and chargers directly to that port without the need for additional devices such as a BatteryProtect to switch the loads/chargers on or off (technically it's a built-in BatteryProtect)

Be aware that this counts only for chargers and loads connected directly to the System+ port. If you bypass the port, additional measures, such as a BatteryProtect, must be taken to protect the lithium battery.

See also the Things To Consider chapter in the manual that describes how loads and chargers are controlled, depending on the system design.

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nbo commented · Jul 07, 2023 at 08:18 AM

Is this then the better way to go or do you prefer the loads and charchers connect and disconnect by a yellow wire and on/off function?

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Stefanie (Victron Energy Staff) ♦♦ nbo commented · Jul 07, 2023 at 08:35 AM

The advantage is obvious: less wiring effort and fewer devices involved contribute to simplicity (and is cheaper to buy), but in the end it comes down to your own preferences and the system itself.

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nbo commented · Jul 11, 2023 at 08:39 AM

Just to be 100% I also read the manual of the Lithium battery.

But here is a load/charge connection dotted drawn between charger, load and BMS

is this an optional connection as they are connected to the BMS system+ port?

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Answer 1 · 2023-07-10T06:14:27Z

nbo answered · Jul 10, 2023 at 06:14 AM

Thank you Stefanie, I Will to for the BMS 12/200 to keep things simpel on the boat.

Only other question does the remote on/off switch replace also a Main battery Switch (on the house hold side) because i do not see any in one of the example diagrams.

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Stefanie (Victron Energy Staff) ♦♦ commented · Jul 10, 2023 at 06:25 AM

The answer is in the manual:

https://www.victronenergy.com/media/pg/Smart_BMS_12-200/en/installation-and-configuration.html#UUID-d03af0d4-0f86-6796-fcf6-4f4333c0e356

where it says:

Remote on/off function:

This setting defines what is controlled by the Remote on/off terminals. The default is that it only disables Alternator and System+.

Options are:

Disable alternator & system+: Disable charging via the Alternator port and charging/discharging via the System+ port. The BMS functionality is retained.

Disable alternator only: Disable charging via the Alternator port. The BMS functionality is retained.

Switch everything off: Everything, including the BMS functions, is switched off. This option is suitable as an on/off switch for the system. Note that the BMS continues to consume energy from the battery to maintain the remote control function, albeit less than 0.01W. But this adds up over time and can completely drain the battery in the long run. Therefore, make sure that the battery is completely disconnected from the system if you leave it to its own for a longer period of time.

So if you want the system to be completely disconnected from the service battery, use a battery switch between the lithium battery and the LiON BATT+ input of the Smart BMS. Then only the self-consumption of the battery remains, which is very low.

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nbo Stefanie (Victron Energy Staff) ♦♦ commented · Jul 10, 2023 at 09:57 AM

thank you for putting in more detail.

So the BMS gets its operation power from the lithium service side and not from the starter/alternator side?

as mentioned in other topics

Which is good because then I can create a network at first whiteout the alternator connected. And just with one 230v charger on the system+ (where the additional question raises if the yellow relais connection shutdown the charger completely instead of disconnecting the system+)?

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Stefanie (Victron Energy Staff) ♦♦ nbo commented · Jul 10, 2023 at 10:31 AM

The Smart BMS 12-200 is/was always powered by the lithium battery, unlike the Smart BMS CL 12-100 where older batches are powered by the starter battery (see manual).

To disconnect loads/chargers which are not connected to the system+ port, use the load/charge disconnect ports as described in the manual. If your AC charger does not have a remote on/off, use a BatteryProtect.

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Answer 2 · 2023-10-22T08:03:58Z

big-ste answered · Oct 22, 2023 at 08:03 AM

Does the CL 12/100 still disconnect the charge, if the the battery temperature drops below 5c

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klim8skeptic ♦ commented · Oct 22, 2023 at 08:52 AM

@Big Ste With Victron Smart Lithium Batteries, the BMS will protect the battery from charging at low temps, and high temps.

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