New ESS system is going mental after connecting to grid.

Question

question

p-rogalski asked Oct 21, '23

New ESS system is going mental after connecting to grid.

Hi gents.

Really need some help here as I'm losing a plot a bit here.

I've just (3rd day of constant work) configured my Easysolar, which for some time now worked as off-grid, as an ESS system. However, ESS is not working as it should.

In the idle, when the system is running without the grid-connected, all loads are correct. Critical load around 50W. The A/C load (consumer unit/house) is also correct at 225W - visible through the energy meter EM112. Please see below.

As soon as I connect the grid to the system. Loads are going mental. Pls, see the screens with what's happening with the system.

I'm 100% sure there is no such power demand at that moment.

Update - things I have checked:

1. I have connected the energy meter with the new cable - same behaviour

2. Used the clamp meter on the grid live line - same demand/usage as the meter

3. Connected Victron clamp transformer - same behaviour

What am I doing wrong? What causing the issue? How to fix it into a fully functional ESS system? Appreciate any suggestions...

Multiplus-II ESS EasySolar All-in-One

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p-rogalski commented · Oct 21, 2023 at 05:27 PM

It's almost like it sees neighbour loads. Is this possible?

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Craig Chamberlain answered · Oct 25, 2023 at 07:29 PM

If the external CT isn’t in use, did you reinstall the little jumper link to re-enable the internal CT?

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p-rogalski commented · Oct 25, 2023 at 07:46 PM

Craig this was it! It's all working as it should. Thank you so much!

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gazza p-rogalski commented · Oct 25, 2023 at 07:58 PM

Excellent news!! In the "old" version with the jack socket the connection was automatically made (internally) when the plug was out!! :)

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p-rogalski gazza commented · Oct 25, 2023 at 08:07 PM

@Gazza thank you so much for your patience! You are amazing! I wish I could repay you somehow. Top Man!

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Craig Chamberlain p-rogalski commented · Oct 25, 2023 at 08:01 PM

That’s fantastic news! Sometimes it’s the simplest of things that are overlooked.

Enjoy! :)

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p-rogalski Craig Chamberlain commented · Oct 25, 2023 at 08:08 PM

Oh...you won't believe how frustrating was this journey! I'm so happy I got the solution! So happy this is working. Thank you so much!

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p-rogalski commented · Oct 25, 2023 at 07:37 PM

Hmm, that's interesting...I have not. I will check this straight away. Will let you know.

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p-rogalski answered · Oct 25, 2023 at 08:00 PM

Guys, thank you so much for your contribution to this topic. You are amazing!

@Craig Chamberlain thank you so much for directing me to the right answer.

@Gazza you are a true supporter! your patience and willingness are unbelievable! With people like you, this community can only grow from strength to strength!!!

I'm so grateful. I wish I could buy you a cold one whenever you are.

Very kind regards and may the force be with you!!!!

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Craig Chamberlain commented · Oct 25, 2023 at 08:10 PM

You are very welcome, and although I might have found the simple solution, it was only because every other stone had already been turned over by @Gazza and others. In fact @Marco Nijholt effectively had the correct answer 3 days ago but the differences between the old 3.5mm jack socket and the newer connector obscured the answer a little.

Team effort! :)

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Marco Nijholt Craig Chamberlain commented · Oct 25, 2023 at 08:15 PM

Awesome, knew the behavior looked familiar, but not aware of the new connector on that version of the multiplus

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p-rogalski Craig Chamberlain commented · Oct 25, 2023 at 08:28 PM

My wife is almost in tears that she finally got her husband back, and I didn’t go mental. Haha

Joking apart, I’m so very grateful. Have a great evening!

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Craig Chamberlain p-rogalski commented · Oct 25, 2023 at 08:36 PM

Sounds like you need to book a table for two at a nice restaurant to celebrate!

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gazza commented · Oct 25, 2023 at 08:05 PM

Totally welcome. We have all pulled our hair out sometimes... Hopefully now time to enjoy what you have created!

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Modifications Space

Node Red Space

Answer 1 · 2023-10-21T19:52:28Z

mjs500 answered · Oct 21, 2023 at 07:52 PM

clamp amp meter help you check your amp load

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p-rogalski commented · Oct 22, 2023 at 08:50 AM

I have checked the amperage and the correct load is on the first picture. It's all go mental as soon the grid is connected to the EasySolar.

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p-rogalski p-rogalski commented · Oct 22, 2023 at 11:42 AM

ah...I got what you mean now. I have plugged the clamp meter and it corresponds to what the energy meter shows.

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Answer 2 · 2023-10-21T21:44:39Z

Marco Nijholt answered · Oct 21, 2023 at 09:44 PM

Assuming you're not using an external meter

Sounds like an issue I've had, grab a 3.5mm plug, and go inside the amp meter socket on the bottom of the multiplus (make sure its off while you do it). Insert and remove multiple times.

The issue is that sometimes the socket internally makes contact (i think), making the multiplus think an external current meter is connected. So it uses that as value for loads which can make it do all kind of things. In my case it started happening randomly at night, making my power turn off/on multiple times due to overload alarms and eventually it blew a fuse internally.

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p-rogalski commented · Oct 22, 2023 at 09:01 AM

I use an energy meter EM112 to measure the grid and don't use the current clamp. However, I have it all installed so will try today. Mine hasn't got a 3.5 jack plug, it came with a 2p terminal.

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Marco Nijholt p-rogalski commented · Oct 22, 2023 at 10:31 AM

If you're using an external meter, then that's probably not the issue indeed.

Seems like they changed the 3.5mm jack on newer models then as well, sounds like a good idea.

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p-rogalski Marco Nijholt commented · Oct 22, 2023 at 12:09 PM

The current transformer is connected but there is no difference.

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mjs500 p-rogalski commented · Oct 22, 2023 at 06:17 PM

The current transformer is connected but there is no difference. did you change config in remote console and ess grid metering to inverter charger with Ct connected as even with a remote ct in use you still have to use ( ess grid metering to inverter charger ) setting for it stop using the EM112 for grid metering

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p-rogalski mjs500 commented · Oct 22, 2023 at 06:32 PM

No, I have only activated the current transformer (CT) in inverter settings. The grid meter was still set to measure by the external meter.

I'm not at home at the moment. Will check this tomorrow and will feedback. Thank you

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Answer 3 · 2023-10-22T18:22:42Z

mjs500 answered · Oct 22, 2023 at 06:22 PM

clamp amp meter help you check your amp load independent of your Easysolar

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p-rogalski commented · Oct 22, 2023 at 06:41 PM

Yes, I didn't get it initially. I've connected one and it reports exactly the same figure as the energy meter. However, I've noticed that demand is stable and then suddenly inverter overproducing. Forcing energy to be pushed to the grid, and then it all starts jumping. It's almost like the data is skewed or missing.

Is it possible the energy meter sends some faulty information to the inverter causing this unbalance and madness?

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gazza p-rogalski commented · Oct 22, 2023 at 07:39 PM

Just to be sure... ?

On the remote console under Devices menu. Meter > Settings > Role > Grid meter

and under ESS menu Grid Metering > External meter

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p-rogalski gazza commented · Oct 23, 2023 at 03:48 PM

Yes, it was set like this originally.

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gazza p-rogalski commented · Oct 23, 2023 at 05:16 PM

Where/how is your Meter connected "physically" in the system?
What I am trying to work out is from your statement when grid is disconnected:- "The A/C load (consumer unit/house) is also correct at 225W - visible through the energy meter EM112"
The thing is with an ESS system with a "Grid" meter if you disconnect the grid then AC In will be blank (as it is).. but the meter will not measure AC loads, since it is before your consumer unit? I am assuming that AC is fed to your Easysolar via an MCB?RCCB from that consumer unit since your AC loads are shown as a parallel setup ie onAC In ?

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p-rogalski gazza commented · Oct 23, 2023 at 06:13 PM

Understand. What is missing from the picture is an A/C isolator between the Victron and the meter. Basically when I switch the isolator OFF the grid still can feed power into the consumer unit.

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gazza p-rogalski commented · Oct 23, 2023 at 07:02 PM

Ok. So the system does not follow the Grid set point/ (what have you set?)...and I guess you have all Feed-in disabled?

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p-rogalski gazza commented · Oct 23, 2023 at 07:08 PM

That's correct. The grid setpoint is set to 0. However, I had it set to -10W or 10W doesn't matter it's ignoring the setting anyway. Yes, feed-in is all disabled, but again Victron ignoring this as well.

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gazza p-rogalski commented · Oct 23, 2023 at 07:15 PM

Are you sure you have the RS485 version of the meter? I know the ET112 is definitely compatible but is the EM112 compatible with the EasySolar? Do you have the latest firmware installed?

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p-rogalski gazza commented · Oct 23, 2023 at 07:27 PM

This is what I'm not sure. However, I have managed to connect with the meter using Carlo G. software and rs485 cable. It reported all the details, but I'm not sure if Victron sees the data in the same way.

According to the Victron energy meters manuals, it should be compatible, but I've just ordered ET112. Just to make sure. It should be with me tomorrow.

The Victron is running on the most up-to-date software, but in the meantime, I have gone back to the previous version to see how it behaves. It was the same.

Gazza, thank you so much for your patience and support.

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gazza p-rogalski commented · Oct 23, 2023 at 07:39 PM

No problem. I do get the sense that the meter is somehow not reacting properly with the ESS. tbh it is always really difficult diagnosing these sort of system instablities by text!! :) Sometimes you just have to be there to look at the many many variables in a Victron system!
The EM112 should have a model number something like EM112-DIN AV0 1 X S1 PF B, the important bit is the S1 model. See what happens when you get the ET112. If you still have the same problem then all you can do is go right back to basics with the set-up procedure for the ESS , tedious I know... but there will be a setting or a tick box somewhere that is causing grief. Best wishes

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p-rogalski gazza commented · Oct 23, 2023 at 08:04 PM

Yes, you are right. It would be very simple for someone who knows what he is doing :)

I will feedback tomorrow when the new energy meter arrives. Let's see what happens there.

Thank you anyway for your support. Let the force be with you.

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p-rogalski gazza commented · Oct 24, 2023 at 05:11 PM

Got the ET112. All connected. All the same ;(

Absolutely devastated!

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gazza p-rogalski commented · Oct 24, 2023 at 09:53 PM

Is there any difference when you remove the CT clamp completely? I am not sure why you are using both that and the ET112?
I am also dubious about the CT clamp(you have) being the correct current ratio? Do you have the Ext Current sensor checked in the VE Config 3 page? If so I would uncheck it, upload the file update and disconnect the CT clamp from the system. Then set-up the Meter and ESS for Grid. It's time to start removing "variables" to troubleshoot this.

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p-rogalski gazza commented · Oct 23, 2023 at 05:50 PM

EM112 energy meter is connected to the grid cable, then to the inverter "A/C in" cable and consumer unit. Something like the picture below :

"updated drawing of my installation"

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gazza p-rogalski commented · Oct 23, 2023 at 06:28 PM

You don't show the Neutral connection to the EM112?

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p-rogalski gazza commented · Oct 23, 2023 at 06:44 PM

Sorry, this is quite a poor drawing. I have the neutral connected to the meter on a 1mm cable with a 1A fuse (the cable is connected as per manual to the left side). It's only for keeping the meter on.

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gazza p-rogalski commented · Oct 25, 2023 at 11:48 AM

How is the AC out (critical loads) connected in relation to the AC In side as you have shown. Does it feed another consumer unit somewhere?

Could you show a bit more detail regards the switching of your energy meter please. Sorry for the 20 questions.

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p-rogalski gazza commented · Oct 25, 2023 at 06:02 PM

Not a problem. Please don't worry.

I have updated the drawing of my electricity setup. Yes, it does feed into a small load in the garage. Mainly, the boiler, wifi extender, lights etc.

"Could you show a bit more detail regards the switching of your energy meter" - not sure if I got this one. The meter is constantly on.

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p-rogalski p-rogalski commented · Oct 25, 2023 at 06:05 PM

I have a feeling the inverter/software is not working correctly. When the grid is ON and system has this erratic behaviour. Regardless of my Grid Current Limit settings (3A) it can charge with 20amp. Feels like the software or controlling unit is somehow corrupted and ignores all the settings.

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gazza p-rogalski commented · Oct 25, 2023 at 06:45 PM

It's certainly possible. You could check the firmware update via VRM > Device list menu?
You mentioned in an earlier comment that you had a bypass switch somewhere in the system that you didn't show on a previous sketch? Not siure if that was the meter or the easysolar ?

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p-rogalski gazza commented · Oct 25, 2023 at 07:00 PM

The firmware is up to date according to VRM - 3.11.

In regard to the isolators - pls see the picture below. The left one is the A/C out-feeding the garage consumer unit, and the right one is the A/C in goes through the wall into the grid connection.

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Answer 4 · 2023-10-23T16:00:56Z

p-rogalski answered · Oct 23, 2023 at 04:00 PM

Okay, I have tested the current transformer option (turned external meter- grid monitoring). Although, it doesn't go metal like before the readings are totally wrong. On top of that inverted started to charge the battery from the grid with a power of 900W. VRM showed -225W at that time on the A/C Input side. It looks like the Inverter is not considering or ignoring the ESS settings. I have optimised without BatteryLife set there. What the heck?

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Answer 5 · 2023-10-23T19:32:41Z

Daniël Boekel (Victron Energy Staff) answered · Oct 23, 2023 at 07:32 PM

Hi @P. Rogalski

I've briefly looked at your system, it's running in inverter mode most of the time, and VRM logging interval is set to 15 minutes, so when running from grid, there is not much useful information visible.

If you set VRM logging interval to 1 minute, more information would be logged.

Still I think it has to do with the external current sensor connection, can you share a picture of this?

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p-rogalski commented · Oct 23, 2023 at 08:16 PM

Hi Daniel,

Thank you for your response and contribution to my subject.

I have tried lots of different options today and eventually disconnected the energy meter from the system. I've just tried to connect it again and the Victron stopped receiving signals from RS485 and discovering units connected to this port :(.

I have restarted the inverter many times but the USB stopped responding, so I won't be able to show you the behaviour. In the meantime, after talking to Gazza I've decided to purchase a new energy meter this time ET112. Let's see if this will change anything. However, if the USB is not working I don't think we can move forward. I will feedback tomorrow if you are still available.

Ahh, I'm not having a great experience with Victron :(

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p-rogalski commented · Oct 23, 2023 at 08:32 PM

Hi Daniel,

I have managed to get it going again. The behaviour is the same as before.

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Daniël Boekel (Victron Energy Staff) ♦♦ p-rogalski commented · Oct 24, 2023 at 09:16 AM

Hi @P. Rogalski

Can you share a picture of the 'external current sensor' connector?

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p-rogalski Daniël Boekel (Victron Energy Staff) ♦♦ commented · Oct 24, 2023 at 04:27 PM

Hi Ben,

I don't use the current transformer. I have an ET112 energy meter installed.

"PICTURE OF the current sensor removed as it is not in use and it confuses the research for the fault. ET112 energy meter is in use"

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mjs500 p-rogalski commented · Oct 24, 2023 at 05:47 PM

100 -1V CT is ct from victrom ? as victroms ct show 100- 50mA i.e. current output type ct and that one voltage output type ct !

and make show current flow is around right way through the ct

two arrow on top ct need point to the load

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p-rogalski mjs500 commented · Oct 24, 2023 at 05:53 PM

To be honest I'm not sure. The point is that I prefer to use an energy meter ET112 instead of the current transformer. I had it installed so I've tried to see if there is any difference but neither of the options work so far.

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nickdb ♦♦ p-rogalski commented · Oct 24, 2023 at 05:58 PM

It doesn’t appear to be a victron part.

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p-rogalski nickdb ♦♦ commented · Oct 24, 2023 at 06:08 PM

it probably is

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nickdb ♦♦ p-rogalski commented · Oct 24, 2023 at 06:15 PM

Could be. Has it been extended by any chance? Looks like it has been heatshrunk around a join.

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p-rogalski nickdb ♦♦ commented · Oct 24, 2023 at 07:07 PM

Yes, it has been extended. The distance from the grid to the inverter is around 13m.

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Answer 6 · 2023-10-24T21:22:26Z

mgb07 answered · Oct 24, 2023 at 09:22 PM

Yip, should be a 100A:50ma type, this is what I use in my Victron ESS. The voltage type is probs not compatible and may be causing the volatile readings as the inverter is looking for a current and not a voltage. You can buy them on Amazon or thru Victron suppliers, quite cheaply.

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p-rogalski commented · Oct 25, 2023 at 05:41 PM

Sorry for the confusion. CT current transformer isn't in use. For grid measuring ET112 energy meter is installed.

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Answer 7 · 2023-10-28T10:50:01Z

mjs500 answered · Oct 28, 2023 at 10:50 AM

missing link ! glade to see it working page 31 multiplus- ii manual, you having just much fun chasing a round as me with the zigbee wireless link for grid meter and still have not got a answer as why it be find by venos OS now wire link in place working ok but

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