Adding a wind turbine

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question

jsrmorgan asked Apr 15, '23

Adding a wind turbine

Hi,

My installation consists of a 48/5000 Multi-plus a Cerbo GX a GX touch and two strings of panels with two MPPT VE can 250/100 controllers and three US2000 Pylontech batteries which have been working excellently for the past 12 months ( so good to be off grid).

Although on most days the SOC is back to 99% by midday or earlier I would still like to add a1500 watt wind turbine for those winter days that don't produce enough solar to fully charge the batteries and then need the Gen set to top them up. I believe using a 2kW off grid 48 volt wind controller with a dump load fit for purpose would work well with my system but I just wanted to check with the experts for any tips and traps. The idea would be to parallel the wind turbine controller up to the battery side of one of the MPPT controllers and also set the parameters on the wind controller to a lesser value than the DVCC so as to not override the Cerbo and damage the batteries.

I would greatly appreciate anyone's thoughts and advice.

Regards

Morgs

Hydro and Wind Power

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Troy commented · Feb 25 at 08:12 PM

Hi this is Troy

I know you had posted this in 2023

Could you please contact me I have many questions to ask you about your Victron MPPT and how to also wire my 400 w

Wind turbine to my controller plus other questions

Thanks Troy

parrotfish42@gmail.com

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Modifications Space

Node Red Space

Answer 1 · 2023-04-15T20:44:29Z

marcve answered · Apr 15, 2023 at 08:44 PM

@jsrmorgan. As far as I understand, the problem you have is, that your wind-generator controller cannot be regulated by your multi for what it needs to produce to charge your batteries. I would implement something like a "over-voltage switch" that, when the voltage on the MPPT side gets to high because the batteries are close to fully charged and the windturbine is pushing the voltage over the charge limit, because of the output of your wind-turbine, it would switch off your turbine input.

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mvas commented · May 23, 2023 at 03:33 AM

The charge controller of the wind turbine will charge or not charge the batteries based on the voltage of the battery. No need for wind turbine charge controller to also be "controlled" by the Multi.

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Answer 2 · 2023-04-17T06:40:46Z

nesswill answered · Apr 17, 2023 at 06:40 AM

Hi i like you have decided to do this as a "top-up " measure as i too are at 100% charge between 10 & 12 everyday, i have a controller that came with my wind turbine, once the batteries get to a set voltage the Wind Turbine Controller turns the turbine off, once it drops below a set voltage the Wind Turbine Controller turns the turbine on, i run this through a separate SmartShunt so i can see exactly what it produces.

I personal would not "parallel the wind turbine controller up to the battery side of one of the MPPT controllers" but run as i have see pic below. Not saying it would not work just personal preference.

So far this has worked for me but the key is to have a Wind Turbine Controller that you can setup and protect your batteries.

48583-1676533773554.png (163.3 KiB)

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Answer 3 · 2023-04-17T07:40:55Z

snoobler answered · Apr 17, 2023 at 07:40 AM

Educate yourself on wind and use this calculator to sanity check any claims made by turbine manufacturers:

https://www.omnicalculator.com/ecology/wind-turbine

Some of the claims are outrageous.

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Michelle Konzack commented · May 23, 2023 at 11:25 AM

Ha ha ha, the Atlas X for 1290£ is an example of pure fraud. 7kW!

Not Turkey or even China can do this for this price and the also sell in the EU...

This should give already a HUGE WARNING that there is something going on badly!

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nesswill commented · Apr 17, 2023 at 07:43 AM

Complete agree .

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Answer 4 · 2023-04-17T08:28:43Z

Michelle Konzack answered · Apr 17, 2023 at 08:28 AM

I assume, that your Wind Charger has a remote break contact, hence you can use the Cerbo GX to stop the windmill, if the Battery has reached the optimal voltage.

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nesswill commented · Apr 17, 2023 at 08:41 AM

No the charge controller that came with the turbine does that automatically. (Once setup)

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Michelle Konzack nesswill commented · Apr 17, 2023 at 11:17 AM

...but you can fully program it to the right output voltage?

AFAIK all windcharger (small windmills up to 3,5kW) have no option to set a specific Battery type like you know it from the Victron MPPTs hence you need to stop the windmill externally.

Otherwise a to long "Absorption phase" from the wind charger can cook your Pylontech...

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nesswill Michelle Konzack commented · Apr 17, 2023 at 11:26 AM

...but you can fully program it to the right output voltage?

Yes completely.

windcharger (small windmills up to 3,5kW) have no option to set a specific Battery type

And yes they do and with mine i can get the manufacturer to set it to the battery type before you receive the turbine and controller.

An example below of some of the settings on a 24v system mine is 48v but the same.

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screenshot-20230417-124450-edge.jpg (447.1 KiB)

Michelle Konzack nesswill commented · Apr 17, 2023 at 02:21 PM

Then it should work (hopefully)

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Answer 5 · 2023-04-17T08:45:43Z

Michelle Konzack answered · Apr 17, 2023 at 08:45 AM

Forgotten one thing:

I am Off-the-Grid in Estonia, with SOPzS Batteries 24V/2940Ah (waiting for the upgrade to 7320Ah since my farm is now much bigger) using a MultiPlus-II 24/5000 and heavy DC loads.

I run two SmartSolar systems with 1860Wp and 2460Wp and use in the same time 3 windmills 2000W and two windmills 700W (same repeller as the 2000W ones) and I get just enough windenergy that I can keep things alive!

Jeah, in January 9-18 I got from 2 windmills 2000W and one 700W over 113kWh, hence more them 12,5kWh a day. While my power consumption is in the winter around 7-8kWh a day, I could nicely charge my batteries.

BUT THIS IS AN EXCEPTION

NEVER TRUST WINDMILL MANUFACTURERS.

However hight matters, my windmills are currently only 4m high and I have an open field, but since the original masts are crap (I have currently two broken ones) I will make the masts from 6m standard S355 60mm pipes my self in one piece and not many 1m pieces which have to screwed together and break at the treads.

Think about.

P.S.: 6m high windmills is the physical maximum, what you can handle if you have to maintain it alone.

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usernamepasswordbs commented · Jun 23, 2023 at 06:37 PM

@Michelle Konzack You seem to have a good set-up and good knowledge of integrating the wind and solar so I would like to know if you have a recommendation for a 2000w wind turbine which can be used with the Cerbo/Multiplus/Pylontech set-up that I have.

What turbines have you got (and controllers)?

Is the Istabreeze i2000 any good? I will make my own mast.

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Michelle Konzack usernamepasswordbs commented · Jun 24, 2023 at 05:25 AM

I have tried several different iSTA-Breeze and the most efficient are the i700/48 and i2000/48.

However, I runn the i700 with 107cm blades (original are 96cm) and it produce extreme high output. The problem is, that if you get a stormy weather, you can not more break it, hence you have to stop the i700 by shortcut ING the 3 phases if the windspeed goes over 9-10m/s.

The i2000 is also running with 107cm blades, but if someone think, s/he can get 2kW out, simply forget it. It is around 1500-1650W but work like a charm.

Since I run a 24V system, the 48V Windmills together with a MPPT Charger is just perfect. The drawback is, that the MPPT Charger is more expensive, then the i2000 plus Mast plus stainless steel wires plus foundation plus 80m AXPX 4G25 and a Break Box together.

WindMax2500 1800€

Unfortunately it is only made for Acid/AGM/Gel batteries and I do not know a charger for and Lithium Batteries.

Since LiFePO4 batteries are over 5 times more expensive, I can not recommend them at all for Off-the-Grid Systems. I use only SOPzS Batteries from Poland, which have a lifespan of 20 years and 1500 cycles at DOD 80%.

My current 4 sets of 24V/735Ah (70,5kWh total) cost currently 11.000€ including two shelfs.

The Victron 25,2V/200Ah (5kWh) cost 4500€ hence my system with Victron batteries would eat 63000€. Plyonrech is cheaper, but still horrible expensive.

I consider LFP batteries as good for the use in RVs, Boats or with a Victron Inverter in UPS mode.

Think about.

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usernamepasswordbs Michelle Konzack commented · Jun 24, 2023 at 07:58 AM

Thanks for the replies Michelle. I want my Pylontechs to last as long as possible, as you say, they are expensive!

I am grid-connected.

In the istabreeze instructions it shows a vague picture of where to install the turbine but I think I would need a 12m mast or put the turbine about 50m away. Both of those options would be annoying for me so I would like to ask you have you got obstacles and do they badly affect output?

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Michelle Konzack usernamepasswordbs commented · Jun 25, 2023 at 05:50 AM

I will try to make some photos of the windmills today and post them here.

In my location, I had with two i2000/48 and one i700/40 (my third i2000/48 and my i700/24 have still broken masts) between 9th and 18th of January an Energy Harvesting of over 110kWh, hence around 12,5kWh a day because the wind came from my neighbours field.

However from the first i2000 windmill to the house (distance around 85m) it goes hill up around 3m and the house is 10m high.

The i700 is standing between the i2000 and the house on a distance of 40m and deliver energy as hell...

The second i2000 is more then 100m distance more or less free standing and deliver currently 3 times more energy as my first i2000.

However, my 6m masts are currently not galvanised and not up, hence I still use the original crappy OSTA-Breeze mast but I have only 4m hight.

Since we get here easily several times a year windspeeds of more then 13m/s (the OSTA-Breeze is made for maximal 20m/s) my conclusion is to go with 6m masts build in one uncuted Pipe S355 with 60x4mm (the original mast has 60x3mm).

Ok, currently it is cloudy but I will try later to make the photos.

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usernamepasswordbs Michelle Konzack commented · Jun 25, 2023 at 10:08 AM

Thanks for the replies. That means some big cable runs for you.

Do you use guy-wires?

If you take some photos, could you show the turbines in relation to any obstacles that are there?

Thanks in advance.

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Michelle Konzack usernamepasswordbs commented · Jun 25, 2023 at 02:18 PM

My cables are Aluminium EarthCables AXPK 4G25mm² because 4x16mm nobody can effort.

Here my i2000/48 in the foreground and the i700 in the background.

The hight difference between the foot of the i2000 and the house is around 4m and the posts of my Apple Trees have 2,4m.

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Michelle Konzack usernamepasswordbs commented · Jun 25, 2023 at 02:22 PM

The Pond (I will start digging next year) is standing free and has definitiv the highest power output.

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Michelle Konzack usernamepasswordbs commented · Jun 25, 2023 at 02:27 PM

The The socket is a 80cm ventilation pipe with a lenght of 1,5m, the bolts are treated rods of 1m 45° bended at the end inside the Beton and attached a steel net.

The Anchors are 31,5cm ventilation pipes with 1,8m lenght and I use treated rods M16 of 1m lenght and also with a steel net attached.

The foot and the three Anchors have a handmade round top, to prevent water is standing on.

The wires for the Anchors are 5mm.

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usernamepasswordbs Michelle Konzack commented · Jun 25, 2023 at 05:19 PM

Wow! Those guy-ropes are good for a tropical hurricane!

How far away is the house and the big trees? What is the direction of the wind when you get good production (with reference to the house and the big trees).

Sorry to ask so many questions, I'm not sure if my site is any good as I have trees and buildings quite near.

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Michelle Konzack usernamepasswordbs commented · Jun 25, 2023 at 06:42 PM

The House and the i700/i2000 are in line and in a distance of 70m over the road to the my Forest (on the right side). The Forest behind the house is in a distance of 10m to the house.

My Business Partner has a PDF with the whole area and if I get it I can post it here.

On the first photo where you see the two windmills and the house in the background, the street is on the left and from this corner which is more or less North-East is the Wind very well blowing. The Road is like a wind corridor.

However, most wind comes from South-West from the neighbours 100ha field. Flat like a football field. The location is in my back, when I took the photos from the windmills.

Also you see the free field on the 3rd windmill (at the non existing pond) photo

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usernamepasswordbs Michelle Konzack commented · Jun 26, 2023 at 06:17 AM

Thanks, I really appreciate all the info.

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geraldusmagnus Michelle Konzack commented · Jan 07 at 05:00 PM

Good evening, ISTA BREEZE now has a charge controller for LiFePo batteries, which you program according to specifications (charging curve,...) but does it really work?
I wrote to IstaBreeze directly, apparently everything works... is it true? How can I contact you? You seem to have a lot of experience. My email address gerald574@gmx.de
Thank you

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Michelle Konzack geraldusmagnus commented · Jan 08 at 12:07 PM

No clue, because there are only the

1) Ista-Breeze i/HCC-1500 W-24V 550€

2) Ista-Breeze i/HCC-2000 W-48V 500€

while I would need

3) Ista-Breeze i/HCC-2000 W-24V

which does unfortunately not exist but would be much more efficient.

And from the website https://en.istabreeze.store/

These charge controllers are programmed by us depending on the data sheet of the lithium batteries.
You must send us this data sheet after placing your order. Delivery time of this charge controller approx. 14 days

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Answer 6 · 2023-05-23T02:47:13Z

jsrmorgan answered · May 23, 2023 at 02:47 AM

Hi Everone,

Thanks so much for all the comments and ideas.

Sorry I haven't been able to respond until now but Im back online and loving all the feedback. Thanks Nesswill for the suggestion of wiring in a separate battery monitor, makes much more sense.

I still haven't got my turbine up and running yet, Im having problems finding the right charge controller to go with the 48volt LifePo4 batteries and 1500Watt turbine Im using. Istabreeze ( where I purchased the turbines) have a controller but the parameters are factory set and non adjustable to the end user so that doesn't work for me. Tesup here in Australia have a controller that I think would do the job but their support page doesn't allow any direct communication until you make a purchase? I have emailed them in England but they don't respond so if anyone has any info on charge controller manufacturers that would be awesome.

Cheers

Morgs

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nesswill commented · May 23, 2023 at 04:49 AM

Hi i would not buy Tesup before you read this

Finding a controller is hard but always go for quality backed-up by real-world customer feed-back.

Have a look at this Wind Turbines and victron charge controllers - Victron Community (victronenergy.com) if you have not seen it already, markus might be able to help.

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Michelle Konzack commented · Jan 26 at 08:01 AM

I use this one here:

https://www.schams-solar.de/windmppt.html

Mr. Schwarz (the owner) is speaking english

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Answer 7 · 2023-05-24T00:38:40Z

jsrmorgan answered · May 24, 2023 at 12:38 AM

Hi Nesswill, wow yeah I had a bad feeling about that mob.

thanks heaps for the heads up and info mate, your a bloody legend.

Cheers

Morgs

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nesswill commented · May 24, 2023 at 04:53 AM

Thank you - you are welcome, we are all here to help each other out.

Dave.

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Answer 8 · 2023-05-25T00:18:41Z

jsrmorgan answered · May 25, 2023 at 12:18 AM

Absolutely spot on Dave

thanks again

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Answer 9 · 2024-01-25T22:06:05Z

be-wind answered · Jan 25 at 10:06 PM

We have been using Victron MPPT 250 / 100 charge controller on our wind turbines. there is a way that exports the dc power with little to no spikes, so the controller assumes it is DC solar input. The critical path is to place a Capacitor bank before the controller. This will smooth out the DC and better allow the Controller to react to the wind turbine. The most common capacitor to use for wind systems are a set of 4 or more 450 volt / 470 Uf capacitors, available on ebay.

You can also insert a DC regulator that can be set to a specific voltage range.

The image below connect 3 turbines into a single controller.

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rich commented · Feb 05 at 03:30 PM

How do you deal with braking/dump loads?

Thanks

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erebos commented · Feb 23 at 02:00 PM

Do I see correctly that you connected the two bridges for a given turbine in series and then connected all the outputs of bridges strings in parallel to the charger?

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Michelle Konzack erebos commented · Feb 25 at 07:54 PM

It seems, he does not know, how to connect the Windmill correctly to the 3-Phase Bridge rectifier.

My Windmills are internally connected in Triangle and I get only 3 wires of the Windmill.

@jsrmorgan@gmail.com

Connect the three coild in TRIANGLE take ONLY TREE wires and ONE Rectifier per Windmill. Your setup is currently hopeless wrong.

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Answer 10 · 2024-02-06T10:20:07Z

Michelle Konzack answered · Feb 06 at 10:20 AM

In case of emergency, he is running as hell...

...and pull the BREAK SWITCH!

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