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randy-s avatar image
randy-s asked

Firmware updating to combine older and newer MultiPlus to work in parallel

My apologies for a lengthy post, but I thought a more detailed question would help for a more accurate response. I searched the forum and got a lot of good info but not exactly my situation. I am looking for some guidance in updating and reconfiguring my system. A step by step "Dummies" tutorial would be great, but maybe not necessary.


My system was originally a single MultiPlus 12/3000/120-50, with a BluePower control panel and a BMV-702 battery monitor (only way to get Bluetooth remote access at the time). This was all purchased and professionally installed in June 2016. It feeds a house bank of 6 x Full River DC400 batteries for a total of 1245 AH capacity.


Two years ago I installed an additional MultiPlus, but wired and operating in charge mode only. This was to reduce genset runtime when cruising, which we do 4-5 months each summer. I originally configured it with just the dip switches, with the expectation that eventually it would get fully wired as an inverter/charger and an overall "control panel" running and monitoring the whole works.


I recently installed a CerboGX with a Touch 50 to intially be the control panel for this second MultiPlus (still running as a charger only) with the understanding that it could and would be the grand Control Panel running both MultiPluses as a single unit (paralleled?) It is nicely talking to the second unit, I've upgraded the Cerbo firmware to current (2.73) and have used it to more accurately set battery and charging parameters. However, it is my understanding that I need to ensure the firmwares of both the MultiPlus units are at the correct level to permit this to all operate as a cohesive unit. My first indication that this isn't a trivial plug and play exercise is that the CerboGX will not communicate with the original MultiPlus. I have the MK3-USB adapter, and VEFlash and VE Configure downloaded so believe I have the tools ready to go, but want to confirm the correct order and f/w levels to do the updates.


Specifics:


1st MultiPlus - serial #HQ1537RZ6BL, f/w ver 2702158

2nd MultiPlus - serial #HQ1846742B3, f/w ver 2702430

CerboGX with Touch 50 - serial #HQ20357GUYQ, f/w ver 2.73


So if you please, which device do I update to what level of f/w, and in what order, and using what tool/method? I think I first need to use VEFlash to update the 1st Multi to some level because the Cerbo won’t talk to it right now, and then maybe use VE Configure (or VE Connect) to continue updating both devices to the same level, but I’m just not sure.


Thanks


firmware update
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4 Answers
mvader (Victron Energy) avatar image
mvader (Victron Energy) answered ·

Hi both, any problem due to dates being far apart is to be treated as an exception. Really not something to warn or worry about in advance.

What matters is that both have the same type number, aka productid, which yours do: the seven digit number starts with 2702 for both your inverter/chargers. The last three digits indicate the now installed firmware version.

Update both, using an MK3-USB and VEFlash, to the latest firmware. Which is 2702490.

Careful: such update wipes all settings: you’ll need to reconfigure.

Once updated, setting them up to operate in parallel as well as further configuration is best done using VictronConnect. You can also use its predecessor, VEConfigure & its companion VE.Bus Quick Condig.

Note that we (Victron) don’t offer direct support on this. Our tooling and training around that is aimed at professionals. We make the tools available to end users so you can self so this if you want to, but in case something goes wrong you’ll have to turn to your distributor; or worst case hire an installer to do the config change.

I’ve ofcourse not typed above to be difficult, but do want you warn you in advance, that doing such firmware updates & configs yourself is not something we (Victron) can help you with directly.

So, all the best, hope it all goes smooth!

Matthijs

Ps. I removed the email address that was mentioned above. Thats not for public use.

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marekp avatar image marekp commented ·
@mvader (Victron Energy)

Can you explain, because I do not follow your logic.

The two f/w numbers start with 2702 and this is enough to make both units compatible for parallel operation?

Is identical f/w enough?

If I load the latest f/w (2702490) into the following two MP-II units, will they work i parallel setup?

#1 PMP482305010 / HQ1933GNWXI

#2 PMP482305010 / HQ2049TB7J5

They should if only F/W matters.

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Daniël Boekel (Victron Energy Staff) avatar image Daniël Boekel (Victron Energy Staff) ♦♦ marekp commented ·

Hi @MarekP yes


Please read this document for more info:

https://www.victronenergy.com/live/ve.bus:manual_parallel_and_three_phase_systems

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marekp avatar image marekp Daniël Boekel (Victron Energy Staff) ♦♦ commented ·

@Daniël Boekel (Victron Energy Staff)

I know this document. I have red it many times.

I followed all the suggestions contained in it.

I listened to the Victron Professional training videos. I even passed the exams at the end of them and have diplomas to prove it. :)

Even thou I was sure that I can perform the installation myself, I asked my distributor to sent the installer to perform my parallel installation.

Installer asked Victron for confirmation that the hardware is compatible for parallel operation. Victron confirmed that it is.

And the result was generally disastrous. Parallel system did not work properly.

Even after paying the installer for the installation, I had to do all the work by myself.

Daniël, you know this case. You helped to solve this problem and I am grateful to you for it.

I thought that my case would make Victron to take the compatibility of different h/w revisions, for parallel operation, seriously.

But comments made by mvader surprised me.

He, for some reason, is not aware of the h/w revisions problems when units are parallel.


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Daniël Boekel (Victron Energy Staff) avatar image Daniël Boekel (Victron Energy Staff) ♦♦ marekp commented ·
Hi @MarekP you are using your experiences with a very specific installation trying to help the topic starter, that is very kind, but please understand that thousands of installations work worldwide without any issues.


This topic was about the 'old' model inverters, your system was with early revisions of MPII's and a 6 inverter system with grid-code.

Luckily mvader is correct that h/w revisions are normally not a problem, otherwise I would be very busy supporting all these systems.

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marekp avatar image marekp Daniël Boekel (Victron Energy Staff) ♦♦ commented ·

@Daniël Boekel (Victron Energy Staff)

You are correct, but this is a public forum. People reading it and learning about your hardware in general, and not only those that are "in the same boat" as the author of the first question.

I would think that it would be prudent on the Victron's part to be specific in the answering the questions.

I bet not everybody distinguishes between Multiplus and Multiplus-II, and BTW it was me who indicated that two original MPs may have no problem.

Also in the Victron Professional training, on the parallel systems, no more then 1 year difference between production dates was stressed as a rule.

P.S.

My 6 units are not the problem. 2 units would have the same problem.

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marekp avatar image
marekp answered ·

@Randy S

You have to update both MPs to the same (latest) FW.

There is more than 3 years difference in production date of those units.

This could be a problem in getting them to work in parallel.

Victron suggests that the production dates should not be different more than 12 months.

Ask Victron support. They should know if it is possible.

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randy-s avatar image
randy-s answered ·

Thanks for the reply. How would I “ask Victron support”? I cannot find anywhere a link or contact to do so.

Also, where did you find information that suggests no more than 12 months apart for production date? All the articles that talk about configuring a system in parallel (or three-phase) talk about firmware and wiring; nothing about the actual production date difference in the units.

Thanks.

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marekp avatar image marekp commented ·

@Randy S

For those 12 months, I heard it in the training video on Victron Professional.

Either here:

https://professional.victronenergy.com/online-training/20/

or here:

https://professional.victronenergy.com/online-training/21/

Anyway, it would be good idea for you to listen to those two couple times each, before you attempt this parallel installation.

Victron Professional requires you to have an account, but it is free.

Based on my experience, with setting a parallel system, the units should be as close at production dates as possible.

I had a problem setting up MP-II units that were less than 1 year apart.

They refused to cooperate in load sharing.

In your situation it my be different, since the original MP has a very mature design compered to new MP-II.

Good luck.


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randy-s avatar image
randy-s answered ·

Thanks for the detailed reply. I have a Professional account so will check out those training videos. I have watched several already but perhaps missed those.

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