question

cruisey1987 avatar image
cruisey1987 asked

Firefighter disconnect switch

It seems in Ireland there's a requirement to have the DC side of a PV setup be disconnected in the event of a fire

Most of the automatic disconnects I've seen will cut the DC connection if there is a grid AC failure (from the firefighters switching the house's power off at the meter box)

This doesn't seem to work well with anti islanding since it would disable your PV in a grid failure

I'm wondering is there a way to accomplish a firefighter disconnect while still having power in a grid failure. I'm thinking perhaps a firefighter switch in the meter box which will open relays to isolate the PV, battery and Quattros would be suitable

Does anyone have any experience in this area?

safetyfire
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kevgermany avatar image kevgermany ♦♦ commented ·

Does it have to be automatic, or do you just need to provide a manual switch?

I fitted solar isolators from Amazon in my van.

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cruisey1987 avatar image cruisey1987 kevgermany ♦♦ commented ·
Seems it has to be automatic, the DC side of the PV array should disconnect in the event of a power cut
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2 Answers
shaneyake avatar image
shaneyake answered ·

I am not from Ireland so don't know the regulation but you could install shunt trip circuit breakers as your PV disconnect and one on your battery. Firefighters turn switch in meter box, causes the breakers to open.

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cruisey1987 avatar image
cruisey1987 answered ·

It seems the guidelines are somewhat contradictory, the DC side of the PV array needs to automatically disconnect in event of the AC supply being disconnected

However backup power supplies are allowed, via a changeover switch. Not sure how they can work properly if they're supposed to automatically disconnect in a loss of mains

Here's the isolator switch section Through these requirements of Part B of the building regulations and I.S.10101, all domestic PV installations installed under this Scheme must:

• Provide an automatic (i.e., automatically operated by disconnection of the main AC supply to the building) shunt (or interlocked) isolation of the circuit (whether AC or DC, and two pole) from the solar PV modules into the building, as close to the solar PV modules as possible, and a maximum of 1.5m internally from the point of cable entry to the building. • Where the circuit from the solar PV modules does not enter the building, this point of automatic isolation must be within 1.5m of the solar PV modules. • For ground mounted system the shunt (automatic isolator) must be within 1.5m of the solar PV modules.

• This system of isolation shall automatically isolate the circuit from solar PV modules when the AC supply is disconnected to the building, i.e., a shunt or interlocked isolation function.

• ‘Shunt’ or ‘interlocked’ isolation of the DC circuit is the only acceptable manner of meeting the Building Regulation TGD B – Fire Safety (2017) for the purposes of this Scheme.

• For the avoidance of doubt the disconnection of the circuit from the solar PV modules must be automatic and operated by removal of AC supply to the building and must not be operated by means of a dedicated switch, pushbutton, ‘fireman’s switch’ or other manner.

• For the avoidance of doubt an isolation of the supply from the PV modules is required in ALL cases, whether micro-inverters, DC optimised inverters, where the inverter is within 1.5m of cable entry or any other configuration is used.

• This system of isolation must automatically reconnect upon restoration of AC supply to the building.

A warning label must be applied to the main external AC connection point to the building stating “In Emergency Solar PV DC Circuit Automatically Disconnected with Disconnection of AC Supply to Building” or an equivalent statement.

And here the section on backup power supplies:

Off-grid operation is defined here as a solar PV (and battery storage) system which is not connected to the electrical distribution system (typically a remote dwelling).

Backup operation is defined here as a solar PV (and battery storage) system which is required to provide electricity to the dwelling during periods of grid outage.

• Off-grid systems must comply with the requirements of this code of practice but do not need to meet the requirements of Section 4.8, and can achieve the requirements of Section 4.7 as per the backup operation requirements below

• Backup operation is permitted so long as the below conditions are met;

- The backup supply from the PV and battery energy storage system must be on the load side of the ESB meter and cannot feed any other premises.

- The requirements of I.S. 10101 must be met, particularly relating to the requirements of ‘standby supply’ and break-before-make changeover switch, and the requirements for neutral treatment in island mode and impacts on protection operation.

- There can be no circumstances where the PV and battery system will feed energy into the grid during backup operation.

- Ensure that, by design, loss of mains (LOM) protection is not compromised. This could be either by relocating LOM to ESBN-Customer interface or by interlocking LOM changeover switch.

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shaneyake avatar image shaneyake commented ·

This is a mess haha. It is not clear what they want you to do.


From my understand it if probably okay to have the mains disconnect switch in the meter box trigger the shunt breakers that are close to the PV modules.
Nothing is said about your inverters and batteries. It seems like those can stay on.

The transfer switch and LOMs is built into the Multiplus-II or Quattros-II and the certification they have should be good enough for the authorities.

You best beat is probably to contact someone local who has an understanding of this regulation. I am not from Ireland so don't know how they are intending you to make this all work.

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cruisey1987 avatar image cruisey1987 shaneyake commented ·
Yeah that's pretty much my reading as well, if the mains disconnect switch will also isolate the solar PV and batteries then that should be sufficient


Will definitely speak with a local electrician, but they tend to want to setup the system their way and I want to ensure it does what I want as well

The built-in LOM protection on the Quattro doesn't work for Ireland, the standard here is different for some bizarre reason, so I'd need to get the anti islanding box that Victron sell and program it manually


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shaneyake avatar image shaneyake cruisey1987 commented ·
Correct the LOM on the Quattro does work for most countries but the Quattro-II should be allowed in most countries. Not sure if certified yet in Ireland. If aren't using a generator then could just the Multiplus-ii, normally works out cheaper.
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