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scott-sd avatar image
scott-sd asked

BMV Mid Point Voltage 4.2%

Hello. New guy, new installation, first time installing a complete Victron system. I am in need of some advice from the subject matter experts here. I am in the tail end of the install on my toy hauler and am experiencing a mid point alarm. A little bit of background, the trailer has an AmpereTime 200ah 12v battery, which is now almost 2 years old. The new install is a 24v system composed of a MP2 24/3000/70, (3) MPPTs, Lynx, BMV712, Battery Protect, Battery Sense, Battery Balancer, and a 2nd AmperTime 200ah battery. I added the battery balancer due to the differences in battery age. Before power-on and commissioning of the system I did charge each battery independently to 100% SOC, noticing a 0.1v difference. The batteries have only cycled a few times at this point. Mid point voltage is 0.2% during bulk, but somewhere toward 100% SOC it peaks to 4.2%. I have not yet noticed if the battery balancer is working.

Settings:

  • Ampertime charge voltage: 14.6v (no mention of abs or float) x2 = 29.2v
  • Victron factory presets:
    1. Absorption = 28.8v
    2. Float = 27.6v
  • Current Manually Entered
    1. Absorption = 28.0v
    2. Float = 27.6v

Is the 4.2% mid point alarm concerning? Should I ignore the imbalance? How to correct or improve it without buying a new battery? Can I further drop the voltage setting for absorption?

BMV Battery Monitor
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4 Answers
kevgermany avatar image
kevgermany answered ·

You need to increase the absorption voltage to 29.2V, not decrease it.

What tells you the balancer isn't working?

My system does go out of balance a little under load/charge. But nowhere near this much. It also comes back to about 0.1%. This can take some time due to the low balancing current and battery size.

Which battery is low? I suspect it's the older one.

If you don't have wiring problems, like high resistance/poor connections, unequal cable lengths, it's likely that the older battery is causing the imbalance and should be replaced.


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iammotorhomeless avatar image
iammotorhomeless answered ·

@Scott SD Is it a Victron Battery Balancer ?
I have never bought or seen one used. the spec sheet says it only balances at 0.7 amps
that's not a lot for a pair of 200Ah batteries

I don't think the AmperTime have Bluetooth or a BMS App to see what each cell is doing.
is it the older battery that is low ? (you say 2 years old... but how much use/ cycles has it had)

I have 4 x 100Ah Epoch batteries as a 48V system. to start with my mid point was always high around the 4%, and the BMS on the highest battery would alway shut off, before the others were charged
with your AmperTime batteries, one of them might be turning off the Charge Mosfets, and you would never know with out access to a BMS App.

I fixed mine by buying the ECO-WORTHY 48V Battery Equalizer as it balances at 5 Amp per battery
their 24V version balances at 10 Amp https://amzn.to/40kH8Q4

my batteries were all new at the install, with the 5 Amp balancer fitted, now my mid point never moves above 0.3% and drops to 0.0% as soon as the bulk charging stops


plus now, if one of the batteries BMS turns it's Charge Mosfets Off, it's not for long, as the balancer quickly starts draining it, to bring the others up to voltage

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scott-sd avatar image
scott-sd answered ·

Thank you both for taking the time to answer my question.

@kevgermany I did not know if the balancer was functioning because it kicks on at 27.3v and I only had the system in absorption a few times, but I did check it yesterday and it is in fact functioning. It was flashing a warning light that one battery has higher voltage. When I charged both batteries prior to install, the older battery was reading 0.1v lower. Concerning the absorption setting, I heard that lithium does not need a the charge stages like a lead acid battery. I got the suggested voltages from the diy forum.

@IamMotorHomeless I am not having issues with the battery BMS kicking in and shutting the system down, it might be due to my lower absorption setting. Now that I know the balancer is working, I don't think it can handle that amount of imbalance. I will take your suggestion on the EcoWorthy balancer. For $28, it is worth a try. I just don't want to order another battery. I told my wife that I was done spending $$....

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iammotorhomeless avatar image iammotorhomeless commented ·

@Scott SD yes, I don't want to turn people off buying the Victron Battery Balancer, as 0.7Amps is fine for lead acid and other batteries that have a steep voltage curve, and spend a lot of time in absorption mode. But with Lithium batteries, I have found that you need a good amount of Amps to make something happen fast.
And if you buy the EcoWorthy balancer off amazons, (and if you are gentle with it) if it does not fix the problem, you could always send it back.
but it fixed my problem in the first day of wireing it in.

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kevgermany avatar image
kevgermany answered ·

What is the actual voltage on each battery, measured with a meter?

True, lithium does not need absorption. But it does need time close to fully charged for the BMS to balance the cells internally.

Are these batteries specced for use in series?

Have you measured the length/resistance of the connections from balancer to batteries?

If one battery was lower than the other when you precharged, it suggests that either it's old/tired, or cell imbalances caused it to cut the charge, or that the BMSs are set differently.

Assuming a 14V fully charged voltage (makes numbers easier), 4% means a voltage difference of 0.56V. This does not agree with your measured differences. But does imply wiring issues if the 0.1V still holds. You can measure the voltages seen by the balancer at its terminals. Giving those and the actual battery voltages all measured with the same meter would help a lot.

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