question

michaelvh avatar image
michaelvh asked

Victron EV charging station + ESS configuration possibilities

Hi guys, this may be a question for the Victron team. I am looking to purchase the new EV charging station, but i have some questions on how it can be configured together with a grid bound ESS system, i could not determine the answer myself on the available documentation or video.

This i was able to find: In automatic mode it will only use excess energy when the home battery is fully charged, and in off grid systems it is possible to set a minimum SOC for the home battery.


My questions:

1. Is it possible to set a minimum SOC for the home battery in a grid bound ESS system before the EV charger kicks in? For example, when the ESS minimum SOC is lets say 20% before getting power from the grid, can the minimum SOC for the EV charger be set at 50% at the same time? In this case the EV charger would use the home battery from 100% to 50%, and the remaining 50% to 20% would be reserved for domestic use at night. Would the EV charger stop using the home battery at set SOC, and only solar power afterwards?


2. A follow up question. Would it then be possible to set the maximum power drain from the home battery? Lets say while charging the EV, it will use all available solar, and only XXX watts from the home battery? This so some reserve power is available for domestic use without having to use the grid.


Thanks!

Michael

ESSSOC
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sladek-cz avatar image sladek-cz commented ·

Hi

I work externally for a supplier company in the Czech Republic and they test and configure your products for their customers. I have a few questions and observations about your EV charger product.

I would like to be able to set the minimum charging current in automatic mode so that the charger does not turn off because of every cloud. The endless replay makes this mode unusable.

We have customers who would welcome a different algorithm in automatic mode because they are not allowed to supply surplus to the network.

Is it possible to pair the charger via GX AP point? Or is a router with internet necessary?

I can't seem to find the "Auto ON Grid" tab.


Thank you in advance for your reply.

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Lucian Popescu (Victron Energy Staff) avatar image Lucian Popescu (Victron Energy Staff) ♦♦ sladek-cz commented ·

Hi,
The minimum current allowed by the vehicles for charging is 6A, can't be lower than this. So event if we make configurable, it can't be lower than 6A, that's a limitation on all the vehicles.
For charging algorithm, yes, we are working on a different one, not related to grid feed in.

Yes, the EVCS can be connected to GX AP but also the opposite, connect GX to EVCS AP

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michaelvh avatar image michaelvh Lucian Popescu (Victron Energy Staff) ♦♦ commented ·
Tesla's vehicles can take 5A on both 1 phase and 3 phase charging. Their charging stations and mobile chargers do it as well. Maybe consider the option to configure down to 5A? As they own a big chunk of the EV market.
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Lucian Popescu (Victron Energy Staff) avatar image Lucian Popescu (Victron Energy Staff) ♦♦ michaelvh commented ·

Hi, not all Teslas are acceping 5A, it depends on the model and manufacturing year. Mine for example is not accepting 5.

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17 Answers
Lucian Popescu (Victron Energy Staff) avatar image
Lucian Popescu (Victron Energy Staff) answered ·

Hi, At this moment, the charging station starts charging only when there is energy export into the grid. In a normal ESS, that's happening only when the battery is full. We are planning to add a new algorithm for off-gird that will work based on battery levels, and maybe we can also apply it in ESS.

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michaelvh avatar image michaelvh commented ·

Ok thank you, sounds good. Keep us up to date on that, would be very interested in those specific control settings. IMO would make it a superior product compared to other smart EV charging stations.

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Lucian Popescu (Victron Energy Staff) avatar image Lucian Popescu (Victron Energy Staff) ♦♦ michaelvh commented ·
Sure! Order the product and I can add you to the beta-testers group.
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Rene Mullie avatar image Rene Mullie Lucian Popescu (Victron Energy Staff) ♦♦ commented ·
@Lucian Popescu (Victron Energy Staff) : I just received the EV charger and installed it, will not see car/ start charging.

Can you add me to BETA group so I can seek support over there? Thx!

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Lucian Popescu (Victron Energy Staff) avatar image Lucian Popescu (Victron Energy Staff) ♦♦ Rene Mullie commented ·
Hi Rene, can you please update it to the latest firmware?

Also, please update the GX to the latest BETA.

Please keep me posted

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james-simpson avatar image james-simpson Lucian Popescu (Victron Energy Staff) ♦♦ commented ·
Hi. I have a grid bound system, with the Victron EVCS. I would be very interested to be able to choose the SoC level at which EV charging commences when in auto mode. So, for example, if it’s a nice sunny day and I need to drive the car in the afternoon, I could use Solar to charge the car in auto mode in the morning, and then finish off charging the house ESS in the afternoon.


Would you be able to add me to the beta testers group if this is a feature you are working on please? if not, do you think I would be able to implement it in node red? Thanks.

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canarias avatar image canarias commented ·

We are planning to add a new algorithm for off-gird

Hello Lucian, that's interesting indeed. But will this algorithm be able to differentiate between Li and Pb systems? Lithium should be easy, but within lead-acid systems absorption times have to be considered additionally to prevent constant PSOC states. I guess this is a bit more complex than just using the SOC state, isn't it? Just wanted to mention that.

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Lucian Popescu (Victron Energy Staff) avatar image Lucian Popescu (Victron Energy Staff) ♦♦ canarias commented ·
Hi, yes, battery charging should have priority, especially for lead-acid
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pampalasek-cz avatar image
pampalasek-cz answered ·

Hello Lucian - Im from czech Republic - i have 1piece of EV charger with firmware V3.3/1.19-beta-14 connected to my system with 3pcs Quattros 10000 and 2 Fronius Symo 20.0-3 , i see EV charger at my vrm account and at remote console , but not possible to charge EV cars - Car NOT connected ( try some cars - same problem ) , Cerbo version 2.85 , can you help me with please? My email is : info@svabi.cz , thank you so much , Pampalasek_CZ

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Hi, please add me as admin on your VRM system, so I can have a look - lpopescu@victronenergy.com

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Lucian Popescu (Victron Energy Staff) avatar image Lucian Popescu (Victron Energy Staff) ♦♦ Lucian Popescu (Victron Energy Staff) ♦♦ commented ·
@Pampalasek_CZ Can please check again? It should be ok now
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pampalasek-cz avatar image
pampalasek-cz answered ·

Thank you so much, at now i search for some EVs ... dont have at home.. i write answer to your email when i check it

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Lucian Popescu (Victron Energy Staff) avatar image
Lucian Popescu (Victron Energy Staff) answered ·

Please keep me posted!

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pampalasek-cz avatar image
pampalasek-cz answered ·

Hi Lucian , at now i test with Enyaq - car is detected - next step done :D , but not start charge because Low SOC Limit , at my FV have full Batteries at 100% , but charger 279608210-557895132418790-2580457485213771137-n.jpg


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Hi, is it a stand-alone device? or part of a victron system? If it's part of a victron system, please follow this steps:

For the ev charger, go to settings, general, modbus tcp server, and in there, fill the ip address of the GX device
Then on the GX device, go to setting, services, and enable modbus.
Please keep me posted!

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pampalasek-cz avatar image
pampalasek-cz answered ·

yes , its part of huge Victron system, in Charger web browser i have ip Cerbo gx by discover function and saved , at cerbo i have this fail 279466496_589164349469272_3336459484180363284_n.jpg


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ok, can you add me as admin on that vrm system? lpopescu@victronenergy.com
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pampalasek-cz avatar image
pampalasek-cz answered ·

you have from yesterday - name Pampalasek

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I emailed you.
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pampalasek-cz avatar image
pampalasek-cz answered ·

Awesome NEWS - Lucian GOT IT! First EV Victron Charger work perfectly at Czech Republic - it is first test piece - for now i wait for Enyaq when come with lowest SOC because when i tested have 98 SOC - i took some photos and posted here , very thanks him


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Happy to help!
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Rene Mullie avatar image
Rene Mullie answered ·

First review: after some issues with getting updated to the right EV firmware version in combination with the Cerbo FW version I got it up&running perfectly! Thanks for your help Lucian! Next steps will be fiddling with the rest of the system in conjunction with the auto-charge option.


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Happy to help!
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nuxland avatar image
nuxland answered ·

Will it possible to tell EV-Charger to charge from the grid and not from the battery if I have grid connected ESS system with Gerbo GX?
This would be helpfull when there is very low €/kwh price for few hours.

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Lucian Popescu (Victron Energy Staff) avatar image
Lucian Popescu (Victron Energy Staff) answered ·

Hi, the charging station is the same as any other AC consumer, so it depends on how your ESS system is configured

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nuxland avatar image nuxland commented ·
Ok, lets say that PV is generating 5kw and house is consuming 2kw, then 3kw is used for charging batteries (Batteries are at 50%) And I want now charge my car with 11kw from the grid, because price is 0,02€/kwh.

if i start manual charging with 11kw, then 3kw is taken from PV and remaining 8kw from battery, because my gridsetpoint is 30W default.

yes i can set gridsetpoint to 11kw and then it works as intended, but i have to remember to set it back to 30w when carging of EV finishes.

my questin was, can i set some mde in charger, so it is automatic :)

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CristiMV avatar image CristiMV nuxland commented ·

I have the same issue, so I vote also for getting this feature on the EV charger side instead of playing up and down with the grid limit in ESS.

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Lucian Popescu (Victron Energy Staff) avatar image Lucian Popescu (Victron Energy Staff) ♦♦ CristiMV commented ·

There is a new algorithm for automatic mode, that doesn't require grid feed-in. Coming soon!

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sladek-cz avatar image
sladek-cz answered ·

Ahoj


Externě pracuji pro dodavatelskou firmu v ČR a testuji a konfiguruji vaše produkty pro její zákazníky. Mám několik otázek a postřehů ohledně vašeho produktu nabíječky EV.


Chtěl bych mít možnost nastavit minimální nabíjecí proud v automatickém režimu, aby se nabíječka nevypínala kvůli každému cloudu. Nekonečné opakování dělá tento režim nepoužitelným.


Máme zákazníky, kteří by uvítali jiný algoritmus v automatickém režimu, protože nesmějí dodávat do sítě přebytky.


Je možné spárovat nabíječku přes GX AP point? Nebo je nutný router s internetem?


Nemohu najít konfigurační kartu "Auto ON Grid".


Předem děkuji za odpověď.

s pozdravem Sládek

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motylu avatar image
motylu answered ·

Hello,

I am also from Czech Republic and planning to buy EV and also looking on Victron wallbox, because I have Victron PV system. My system is normally connected to grid (no off-grid) with 3 Multis, 3 MPPTs, Cerbo GX and 14.2 kWh in Pylontech batteries, system is configured as ESS.

My plan is connect EV charger on the AC-out-1 outputs (same as whole house installation) for possibility to charge the vehicle from PV modules (and also batteries) in case of grid outage.

How the charger in automatic mode works? Because during grid outage, there is no feed-in excess solar power. So will the wallbox in auto mode charge the vehicle or not? Is it possible to control charging and set parameters of EV charger using Node-RED flows in Cerbo GX?

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Lucian Popescu (Victron Energy Staff) avatar image
Lucian Popescu (Victron Energy Staff) answered ·

Hi, yes, auto mode is not working off grid yet, but soon will.

Yes there are nodes for EVCS, so you can control it externally.

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motylu avatar image motylu commented ·
Thanks for your answer @Lucian Popescu (Victron Energy Staff)!


Do Victron also plan DC EV charger? From my opinion, charging directly from DC bus without additional losses (conversion DC/AC in Multis and AC/DC in the vehicle) would be much better solution for Victron ESS users, especially only with 3 kVA Multis.
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Lucian Popescu (Victron Energy Staff) avatar image Lucian Popescu (Victron Energy Staff) ♦♦ motylu commented ·

There is a conversion in your example, from DC 48V to DC 400V. And this kind of conversion is not going to be without losses.

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motylu avatar image motylu Lucian Popescu (Victron Energy Staff) ♦♦ commented ·

Yes @Lucian Popescu (Victron Energy Staff) , you are of course right! But your DC/DC converters have high efficiency so I assume that Victron can make high efficiency DC EV charger, because especially DC/AC conversion losses in Multis due to toroidal transformers are not negligible, and charging power is limited by the most loaded Multi (in case of charge EV only from PV or battery, not from grid).


I have one additional question about switching between 1 and 3 phase charging. Is this feature could be done only in firmware (control is on the EV side and its only SW feature) or it needs hardware changes? Will it be possible to have this feature in the future with current hardware version?

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Lucian Popescu (Victron Energy Staff) avatar image
Lucian Popescu (Victron Energy Staff) answered ·

Switching from 1P to 3P requires both hardware and software changes. The current version's PCB is prepared for this, but there is only one contactor inside.

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motylu avatar image
motylu answered ·

Hi @Lucian Popescu (Victron Energy Staff) and everyone, who already has Victron EV charger.

Now I am looking for used EV and I'm deciding between Nissan Leaf (1st generation with 30/28 kWh battery), Renault Zoe (Z.E.40 with 44.1/41 kWh battery) or maybe VW e-Golf (35.8/32 kWh battery). Nissan Leaf has only 1-phase AC charger with max. 6.6 kW charging power (and of course DC CHAdeMO), Renault Zoe has 3-phase AC charger with max. 22 kW charging power (in R90 version or 43 kW in Q90 version) and VW e-Golf has 2-phase AC charger with max. 7,2 kW charging power (and of course DC CCS).

If I assume max. 6 - 7 kW from PV panels, with Nissan Leaf I would have to add at least one 3k Multi in parallel to existing 3k Multi on one phase (for increase available power in one phase), with Renault Zoe or VW e-Golf basically nothing...

I see, there is min. charging current parameter in EV charging station. But I have some additional questions about function, which is not clearly described in documentation:

  1. I assume, if I set EV charger to automatic mode, charging power is dynamically set by EV charger according to excess power from PV panels, right? What about situation, when excess power is not enough to complain with min. charging current/power limitation? Is charging automatically interrupted by EV charger?
  2. Is charging power set according to the lowest excess power (actual lowest excess power in one of three phase)? For example Multi L1 feeds-in 2000 W, Multi L2 feeds-in 1600 W and Multi L3 feeds-in 1800 W to grid, so will EV charger set charging power to 4800 W (3x 1600 W)?
  3. What about situation with VW e-Golf and 2-phase charging? Is it possible with the EV charger connected to 3-phase ESS? What about setting of charging power based on excess power (see question 3.) in case of 2-phase charging?
  4. In the Czech Republic we have condition, that EV charger must have information about actual current/power of whole house installation from grid, and charging current/power must be set by EV charger to not exceed maximal reserved current/power (of whole installation) from grid, which is basically defined by main circuit breaker (for example 3x 25 A). EV charger can be connected via Wi-Fi with Cerbo GX, so it has access to all values measured by the system, especially current/power from grid. Is it possible to set maximal current/power limit consumed from grid and then EV charger can dynamically set charging current/power to not exceed this limit?
  5. Do you plan some additional mode (or implementation in existing modes) with percentage parameter, which could define distribution of actual power from PV panels going to battery and going to EV charger (and home installation because I plan to connect EV charger to AC-out as whole home installation)? For example 60 % to battery and remaining 40 % to home installation with EV charger. Maybe of course some percentage (SOC) parameter, when EV charger can start charging the EV? For example when battery SOC reach 85 %, EV charger will automatically start and charge EV with 40 % of actual power from PV, battery will be charged with remaining 60 % of actual power.

Thank you very much for your answers!

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mathewst avatar image
mathewst answered ·

Some demo logic, seems working in my setup. Grid meter, EVCS, weak grid just 7kw, weak solar big batteries. Quest is to not trip breaker. And car charge is priority. In the night there is some delaying to discharge flow of batteries, to last before people go to sleep.

screenshot-2023-05-05-at-231854.pngscreenshot-2023-05-05-at-231924.png


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