question

guyomk avatar image
guyomk asked

Orion remote input inactive

Hello dear Victron community,

I am experiencing difficulties with an Orion 12-12/30, it is used to charge a victron smart lithium 100a in my van (from 1999 so not smart alternator).

I don't have yet a remote cable would like to make it work with the simple shunt included in the package (doing manual on/off via the app for the moment).

However, whether I plug the shunt or not, it's not charging and displaying message "remote input inactive". When the shunt is in the input voltage is 7.7V, and when I don't use the shunt the input voltage is 13.8V.

What's wrong?

Thanks for your help

orion-tr smart
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kmcintyre avatar image kmcintyre commented ·

I just went through this with my install and mine is the most basic use of the 12-12/18 so it was a bit easier to figure out what the issue is/was.

If you follow the instructions and remote the jumper, open the app and adjust the settings, hook everything back up and reinstall the jumper you have to make sure that the jumper is actually in the slots. I put my jumper back in, tightened the screws and thought it was correct. Once I got the message that you posted, I looked closer at my jumper. I had missed putting the wires in the slot that tightens up against the wires of the jumper. Easy to miss and think the jumper is actually installed correctly. There is a metal piece in the the unit where the jumpers go that may not "drop down" and you aren't actually getting the wires from the jumper in the correct "slot" so that when you tighten the screws the metal piece draws up and tightens against the wires of the jumper. So easy to miss and I did.

I hope that was/is the issue. I am willing to bet it is.

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10 Answers
guyomk avatar image
guyomk answered ·

Hello guys, I found the issue, the fuse between my engine battery and the Orion was actually deficient, which I didn't detect at first sight. Since I changed it the input voltages are OK. I just don't understand how the Orion manages to measure some tension while the input positive wire is not connected, this didn't help to find out the issue. Thanks to all people that tried to help. Cheers.

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Justin Cook avatar image
Justin Cook answered ·

Hi @guyomk, and welcome to the Community!

Please post photos of your installation and the unit itself; the remote bridge cannot itself affect the input voltage, so the above screenshots indicate that something is amiss with your installation. If you post complete photos, from connection at the source battery to the unit itself and from the unit to connections at the target battery, we may be able to assist you in troubleshooting.

Failing that, please reach out to the authorized dealer or distributor from whom you purchased the device for further troubleshooting assistance, or indeed engage a local, reputable DC systems installer to inspect the installation for you.

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guyomk avatar image guyomk commented ·

Hello Justin, I posted some more information and the photo of the installation, any idea?

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guyomk avatar image
guyomk answered ·

Thanks for your answer. I am using an isolated Orion, but I ended up connecting all the negative to the same electrical ground (the body of my van), might the change in voltage caused by this?

I will post photos of the installation asap.


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guyomk avatar image
guyomk answered ·

Here is a photo of the instalation

There is a 125A fuse on the + of the battery, where all + cable are gathered. I also have 60a fuses on the input and output of the Orion. My MPPT is not yet connected to the BMS with a com cable.

Also if I disconnect the input fuse or the Orion, it still stays on, can you confirm is it powered via the output wires?

Thanks for your help



dsc-2354.jpg (5.4 MiB)
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Justin Cook avatar image Justin Cook ♦♦ commented ·

@guyomk, the remote bridge isn't installed in this photo, and the device will not start charging without it. Can you confirm that with the remote bridge installed, (with the jumper in place) and the van running so that the turn-on voltage threshold from the source battery has been reached, the device still does not work?

I will also add that you will not be able to use it with the jumper in place, as you will of course need to run a signal wire between your BMS charge disconnect port and the appropriate pin of the remote bridge, but for testing purposes you could run the Orion with the remote bridge and jumper in place just to be sure it's working.

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guyomk avatar image guyomk Justin Cook ♦♦ commented ·

I confirm that it's not working with the jumper installed (then the input tension falls down to 7.7V)

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kmcintyre avatar image
kmcintyre answered ·

I posted an answer to this but don't see it showing up and can't figure out how to contact you directly. Maybe there's a delay in posting it.

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kmcintyre avatar image
kmcintyre answered ·

@guyomk

Trying again to post my answer....


I just went through this with my install and mine is the most basic use of the 12-12/18 so it was a bit easier to figure out what the issue is/was.

If you follow the instructions and remote the jumper, open the app and adjust the settings, hook everything back up and reinstall the jumper you have to make sure that the jumper is actually in the slots. I put my jumper back in, tightened the screws and thought it was correct. Once I got the message that you posted, I looked closer at my jumper. I had missed putting the wires in the slot that tightens up against the wires of the jumper. Easy to miss and think the jumper is actually installed correctly. There is a metal piece in the the unit where the jumpers go that may not "drop down" and you aren't actually getting the wires from the jumper in the correct "slot" so that when you tighten the screws the metal piece draws up and tightens against the wires of the jumper. So easy to miss and I did.

I hope that was/is the issue. I am willing to bet it is.

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guyomk avatar image guyomk commented ·

thanks for your answer, but i checked my jumper it is fine, and it doesn't solve the problem

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guyomk avatar image
guyomk answered ·

Hello dear community,

yesterday I had time to try to solve the problem without success.
I did connect only the Orion charger, the lithium battery and the engine alternator to perform a clean test without other gear interfering.
In the end the problem is still the same, the Orion input is 12V when engine is off, 14V when engine is on and alternator running.
However when I connect the jumper to activate the Orion, the input voltage drop to 7.7V (almost half of 14V), and Orion doesn't output any charge saying remote is off... I checked the voltage with an external voltmeter.
Is my Orion unit defective? Despite my Orion is isolated, I connected all the negative wires to the same electrical ground (the body of my van), might the change in voltage caused by this?
Might it come from my alternator? It's a classic alternator from 1999 (not smart one) outputting 90A.

Thanks for your help,

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baraduke avatar image
baraduke answered ·

Maybe there is your answer : it seem the problem is due to connection screw of input

I mean if you screw to hard , it’s possible to break the soldering inside

I have prob with mine , can’t charge much than 9amp, after it cut and display exactly same message , as you

You can try to open and check soldering inside or bad connection , it’s possible enough power pass to switch on charger, but not enough power to charge correctly , because it need 20-30 amp to input to work


I don’t know if it’s possible to access inside to check soldering

Good luck

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sebastiang avatar image
sebastiang answered ·

Hey all, new to here and wondering if you guys found out what the problem was?

I have a 2007 T5 2.5l T30 panel van (converted to camper) with a regular alternator. Running 2x 30amp Orion smart dc chargers in parallel (it gives me around 50amps of charge) for my 216amp LifePo4 Tn Leisure Battery. I have a shunt and a battery connect (non smart) and a bmv 712 smart monitor.

All seemed to be working well (has done so for the last 3 weeks), until half way through my drive the other day and the input voltage dropped from 14.2 to 7.7 and I had the same message as you show above. “Remote input inactive”. Once charging has been disabled due to voltage drop, the voltage then tries to creep up again until it reaches it’s starting voltage, turns on for a nano second then drops back to 7.7v turning it off again and the cycle continues.

I am in sub zero weather in Sweden’s artic circle, temperatures have been reaching -18c but currently at around -4c. The battery and charging gear is under my passenger seat and doesn’t drop below +6c, I have a diesel heater running inside the van and a battery temp sensor fitted. I did let my van idle for a couple of hours the day before my drive to charge the battery, I’m hoping I haven’t knackered the alternator. Maybe it’s too much for the alternator to handle and that’s why I am only recieceing 50amps from the 2x30amp chargers? I am not that up together with electrics, I am more of a wood man but I can do a bit and this was all put in by myself and my electrician.

. I have checked terminals and fuses from the starter battery to leisure battery and all seem to be ok. My voltage tester has given up the ghost and I can’t seem to find another near where I am as fairly remote.

Any response/ideas would be greatly appreciated, as you can appreciate, I don’t have a great deal of time before I have to find somewhere I can plug in and charge via the 240v hookup and as I said, I’m fairly remote.

Many thanks.


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michael-necky avatar image
michael-necky answered ·

I seem to have just stumbled into the same problem as @guyomk above. Temperatures are dropping here for the first time this year, and I seem to have run into the problem in the 40F-50F range. 12|12|30A charger has been working perfectly for the previous 6 months. No changes other than weather. I believe I was on an older version of firmware before (v1.05 now v1.06)

Unit begins bulk charging then changes state to "remote input inactive" after 5-30 seconds, and input voltage drops to ~7 volts. Voltmeter confirms this input voltage drop at input terminals. Applying 12V to H pin instead of the jumper does not seem to fix (as this other related post points out https://community.victronenergy.com/questions/79387/remote-ignition-switch-wiring-confusion.html)

Putting unit in power supply mode and using a lower output voltage prevents issue. Issue seems to be related to high output current state (bulk charge)

Looking for victron support to chime in. Currently very disappointed as I depend on this battery charger to work in the winter for heat, which makes this a safety issue.

Yet Another Post Pointing to Similar Issue

https://community.victronenergy.com/questions/102189/orion-tr-smart-remote-input-inactive.html

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Matthias Lange - DE avatar image Matthias Lange - DE ♦ commented ·
Can you try to heat up the Orion a bit to confirm that it is a temperature problem?

If I have time on tomorrow or Friday I will put one in the fridge and test it.

Do you have the isolated or non-isolated?

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michael-necky avatar image michael-necky Matthias Lange - DE ♦ commented ·
@Matthias Lange - DE Matthias - I was able to heat up the charger and battery to >80F however this did not appear to fix the issue. I just received a replacement unit through warranty. The new charger (also running v1.06) has the same exact issue as above. Is it possible to send me an older firmware version to test/help troubleshoot? I believe this to be a software issue. I should include I am attempting to charge a 100AH AGM. Any other ideas for troubleshooting?


Thanks,

Mike

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