Feature Request: Multiplus +GX device-Automatic Generator Switchover

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dannyclark asked Oct 27, '21

Feature Request: Multiplus +GX device-Automatic Generator Switchover

Currently Installed System:

Mutliplus II

BMV712

CCGX

4ea 100ah Battleborn Batteries

ATS (no onboard generator yet)

So, I have an opportunity to add an onboard generator to my already factory "Generator Ready" fifth wheel travel trailer. I have been using an external Champion Inverter Generator simply plugged into my shore power plug, and it's worked fine without me notifying the MPII. From what I can gather from hours of searching here is, if I install an onboard generator utilizing the already factory installed ATS and my CCGX for start/stop and automation with assistants, the MPII won't have a clue it's getting power from a generator. Again, If I'm understanding correctly, I would need to further manually select generator from the CCGX menu and modify L1 input characteristics accordingly? Now I understand why the ATS has no way to communicate with the MPII or CCGX, but what I can't understand is why, when using the CCGX to start/stop/automate the generator, I then have to tell the CCGX the generator is on. "CCGX, turn generator on, and oh yeah, you're getting power from a generator."? I don't understand why I would have to tell it the same thing twice.

So, to the feature request (if I'm understanding everything correctly, which is rare lol), is to implement a simple logic into the UI that when one starts or stops the generator using the CCGX, that the CCGX then implements Generator Display and functionality on L1. Admittedly my limited experience may be blinding me, but I don't understand why any additional hardware would be necessary. I use the CCGX to turn the generator on and off, why would I have to then tell it again a generator is on/off?

As I've seen during my searches, this seems to be a popular scenario (Multiplus and ATS), and simply saying buy a "Quattro II when it comes out" isn't necessarily a fiscally viable option, especially when the CCGX device seems more than capable of the necessary function with a software tweek.

Thanks for any thoughts, clarifications, or consideration on this topic.

-Pete

example of issue:

Multiplus II ESS with generator and transfer switch aux contacts - Victron Community (victronenergy.com)

feature request

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Modifications Space

Node Red Space

Answer 1 · 2021-10-27T18:26:46Z

Matthias Lange - DE answered · Oct 27, 2021 at 06:26 PM

In a fifth wheel you don't use ESS -> problem solved.

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dannyclark commented · Oct 28, 2021 at 03:26 AM

Please explain further Matthias. Isn’t it the same root problem? Any power through the automatic transfer switch is interpreted by the multi as shore power, correct? So the Multi doesn’t change display mode, and it draws power it expects from the grid, which the generator cannot supply. This necessitates a manual selection and modification of maximum amperage draw in order to facilitate proper functioning of powerassist and reduce strain on the generator. Am I getting that correct?

-Pete

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Matthias Lange - DE ♦ dannyclark commented · Oct 28, 2021 at 05:18 AM

The problem with ESS is that you need to select a grid-code and most of them (or all) won't accept a generator as an input.

Without ESS you can adjust the AC input settings to accept both.

About the input current limit:
There is a assistant that you can setup in the MultiPlus called "input current limit control".
With the same signal you use to start the generator (or a signal from the ATS) you can give the MultiPlus the signal to reduce the input current limit.

Use VEconfig and "fake target with full options" to take a look at what is possible.

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dannyclark Matthias Lange - DE ♦ commented · Oct 29, 2021 at 01:43 PM

Thank you Sir. I’ll investigate that option further.

-Pete

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Answer 2 · 2021-10-29T19:59:04Z

jwfrary answered · Oct 29, 2021 at 07:59 PM

I get what you are meaning.

There are some work arounds using assistants in the multi to set the input current in the multi so its correct for the generator however this wont change anything on the GUI.

You could also use the Digital Multi Control to do a similar thing.

It would be cool if in venus OS you could use the generator start stop relay logic to automatically switch the source in the gui. Maybe this could be an extention to the @Kevin Windrem generator connector GUI mod in the future who knows...

Of course this functionality exists with the Quattro out of the box, but it would be great to have something in place for those with more modest installations.

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Kevin Windrem commented · Oct 29, 2021 at 08:15 PM

You really don't want to use the generator start/stop relay to fake the grid/generator input switching because the generator could be running and not supplying the input to the Multi.

What is really needed is to feed an output from the external grid/generator changeover switch to a digital input and have that input provide the logic to switch between grid and generator logic inside of Venus.

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dannyclark Kevin Windrem commented · Oct 30, 2021 at 05:03 AM

Thank you JW. That’s exactly what i was trying to say. Im trying to think of a situation where I would start my generator and not be using it to supply power? I know my usage is very limited compared to others though. As for the ATS, while it’s never actually been used for it’s intended purpose in my unit, it’s nearly 15 years old at this point. Very analog. For all I know it’s a mouse on a wheel lol. Perhaps Victron will come out with a Victron ATS someday. I’d love a Quattro II when it comes out, but I’m not rich having just gotten the MPII :-(

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jwfrary Kevin Windrem commented · Oct 30, 2021 at 05:41 AM

Yes agree, just theres no digital input on a colour control!

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