June 6/25, re; Victron’s Orion XS 12v 12v-50A (used with 2024 F250 Platinum Diesel Turbo, pulling 2021 GD 5th wheel Reflection 240RL)
.I recently upgraded to Victron’s Orion XS 12v 12v-50A (from Vic Orion 12 12 30A). Testing showed all good. My first trip out (3 hours drive), RV batteries SOC 70% approx., with new DC to DC charger pushing 600+ watts (great !). Simultaneously, my solar array was yielding an impressive 700 to 800watts (as expected). No issues.
On our drive back home, RV batteries SOC 80%, solar yield varied (but all good), however my new DC to DC charger was ‘obstinately’ only yielding around 300 to 400 watts (see pics attached). I verified settings, all seem good. I read one thread that mentioned ‘if too hot, the unit may automatically reduce output’.
Can anyone shed some light on possible cause for reduced output from my new DC to DC charger ?
I could make lots of guesses but some more info would be very useful.
1, What battery(s) are you charging to, does the BMS communicate to the GX device, does the GX device contro1, the Orion via DVCC.
2. Does your vehicle have a smart alternator that reduces its output voltage to very low values.
3. The crux here, the screens you showed have little value for debugging. You either need to show the Device screen where it will show the input and output voltages and currents or the VictronConnect app on your phone.
Possible causes
- Poor/loose connections on the wiring
- Low alternator voltage either by design (smart alternator) or failed alternator.
- Victron Smart or NG Lithium batteries installed on float setting.
- Overheating and throttling back.
I will also upload my electric diagram (which includes descrip of my LiFePO4 batteries)
My Sol Wiring v3.2.docx (197.1 KB)
My Sol Wiring v3.2.pdf (112.4 KB)
Add info: my batt BMS do not communicate to the GX device (SOK batteries, but I do have a batt temp sensor connected to my MultiPlus).
OK had a look at your diagrams, good to see someone who knows where everything goes.
On the Orion XS, the negative wire is only a balancing wire, the main negative current flows from alternator negative to battery chassis ground, you need to make sure that path is all connected correctly, no voltage drop. You replies have eliminated several options. You are down to probably
- Poor/loose connections on the wiring either input or output positive or negative. I see you have some breakers listed on the input and output, we often see high resistance on some of the cheaper no name brands, normally brands like Blue Sea are good, Personally much prefer fuses as this issue does not crop up.
- Low alternator voltage either by design (smart alternator) or failed alternator.
- Overheating and throttling back.
If next time it exhibits this you can get alternator output or starter battery voltage, Orion input and output voltages from the app or GX device and house battery voltage, that will be able to show which of the 3 areas are limiting.
The most common one we see is loose connections, if you check the app and the charge current is low but the Orion says the output is at the 14.6V absorption voltage but the battery says it is at 13.6V then you know you have a voltage drop problem. The same is true for the input voltage, if the Orion is seeing say 13.1V but the alternator is at 14.4V.
excellent detailed advice, will run tests and report back here, thank you.
Hi pwfarnell;
See below my replies to each number;
- Poor/loose connections;
.checked all connections, all appear tight.
.good tip on Blue Sea breakers, will consider next time. I use similar, likely knock off’s of same breaker. See pic included.
- Low alternator voltage.
1st Voltage test results with ‘Engin shutdown detection enable’ (several samples, over 10-15min)
.Truck battery 13.96V
.Truck engine compartment, breaker-in, 13.96V
.Truck engine compartment, breaker-out, 13.96V
.Anderson Plug (175A rated), outlet in truck box 13.94V to 13.96V
.RV side, Orion charger – In, 13.8V (no load yet, charger ‘delayed start’)
.RV side, Orion charger – Out, 13.3V (no load yet, charger ‘delayed start’)
.RV side, Orion charger – In, 13.8V 452W
.RV side, Orion charger – Out, 13.1V 462W
2nd Voltage test results with ‘Engin shutdown detection DISABLED’
.RV side, Orion charger - In 12.7 to 12.8V, 635W, 50A
.RV side, Orion charger - Out 14.1V, 623W, 44.3A (see pic included)
I am now thinking this might be a compatibility issue bt my truck’s alternator and my orion charger - when set at ‘Smart Alternator’. I also found a bit of info on this (Alternator Voltage Drop: Many Euro 6+ vehicles have smart alternators that regulate voltage dynamically. When the battery is full, the alternator may drop to 12.3V or lower, causing the Orion to shut down).
I’m open to suggestions.
You could set the shutdown voltage to 12.7 to 12.8V that is still a fully charged engine battery or you could add an ignition wire or a wire from the alternator D+ to turn the Orion on.
I just ran another test, after draining batteries to SOC 60%. I cut off solar feed during this test. I started my truck and connected it to the RV through the Anderson plug (connected to the Orion charger). Unfortunately, the Orion charger immediately produced 650ish watts. Great…, but no so good as I was not able to reproduce the previous few days results of reduced output.
I did however still change my Shutdow Voltage to 12.7V (as you suggested).
I then read trough Victron’s Orion 12 12 50 manual, section 4.5.6. I am leaning towards making another change before our next trip. The next trip will be a long one, approx. 15,000 kilometers over the next 2 months.
Based on what I read in manual, I am leaning towards the following change.
From Vic Manual; ‘Start voltage (Vstart): At this level, charging starts immediately. Default: 14V/ 28V.’
- I would like to change this value to 13.7V
Q; any thoughts on making this extra change ?
That should be OK as it is above the full battery voltage so it needs definite charging from the alternator to start the Orion.
will try that, thank you so much for your advice