PV inverter, panels, battery 50m across the street from house consumption

Hi, I have a “split buildings” house case, wher the grid connection point, the distribution panel and house consumption are located in the main building, while the PV panels, inverter and battery will be located at a storage building, 50m across the street from the main house. The two locations are connected only with a 16A mains cable (3* 2.5sqmm), without possibility to drop any other cable. I want to have a small ESS, to cover part of electricity cost and it would be nice if this could serve as a backup source for outages.

Questions:

  1. Can Multiplus II (or EasySolar II) work in grid parallel (on the 16A line) without power sense, i.e. without transformer or power meter, thus feeding all PV power (or even battery power, according to configuration) back to the grid? Like a microinverter case… The feed-in is not compensated (for now), neither is allowed (for now), but it is not detectable by grid op, either (for now).
  2. In this grid parallel “not detecting grid” case, can the user manual switch to island mode, i.e. switch off the mains and instruct MPII (somehow, easy) to run in off-grid mode, feeding critical sources? Cannot use AC out, there is only one cable connecting MPII with main distribution panel.
  3. Victron AI answered “no” to the above. What is the solution for the inverter to sense the consumption of the house, without having the option to pass another 50m cable (RS-485 or Ethernet) between the two buildings? Is it a power meter with a ZigBee pair, from meter to inverter? Or maybe an Ethernet connection over Powerline? If this is implemented, does the “response” of the remote meter can handle the feed-in of the inverter according to loads, with option for (almost) zero feed-in?

TIA - Dimitri

You can only place the mulitplus near the batteries and indeed let it feed back to grid

as a solution a shelly wifi grid meter could be an option ( i have no experience with that)

without grid metering at all its impossible to control grid feed in/house loads, maybe you can do some node-red magic on that

Critical loads / backup power will only work where the multi is located, so with a single cable you can not feed the house

@grfloater

If you do Not have an external grud Meter, the MP2 used the internal one or direct attached Ct clamps.

Usually you set a “grid set point”, though the MP2 will try to keep a certain energy flow at the metering point, e.g. 1kW into your house on ACin.

The specific setting depends on operation mode e.g. ESS or others.

If you have only one cable, then you need to connect to ACin putting your MP2 parallel to grid and house loads. Offgrid/island is supported on ACout only.

Easiest way to connect a grid meter might be a network capable grid meter like the VM-3p75ct. The network can be transferred by a wireless lan bridge or mesh network for IP. In addition, this IP network will connect your Cerbo GX to the cloud for remote control.

The ACin limit (16A) seems not to be respected by power assist and grid limit. Use breakers for the line.

Thank you both for your replies.

@DuivertNL Of course MPII (or EasySolar) will be within 1m of the battery! (and some 5-7m from the solar panels). But the (house) consumption is across the street, 50m away, with only a 16A mains connecting the two spots. I was thinking of a “micro-inverter” like operation, i.e. feeding whatever panel production (and battery, depending on configuration) to the grid, without throtling it (cannot, since there is no sense of power and direction). I was thinking also of some smart meter/switches, to automate powering on loads (heater, dehumidifier, a/c…) whenever there is sun surplus. And of course, critical loads work only on AC1 out, so normally local to the MPII. In my (2) point above, I was thinking on outages to (manually) switch off mains switch and then reverse the connection to the MPII, from ACin to AC1out, while “programming” it in island (off-grid) mode - all of these somehow automated and secure!

@BjoernK Internal or external CT clamp is not an option, for 50m away from mains panel. I know about “grid set point”, I am using ESS in other installations and I would like to use ESS in this, “remote” case, as well. Yes, I buy your advice about setting an IP network (wireless or over powerline) for a power meter (one phase, my case) etc. There is the option also with Victron’s ZigBee twin kit (USB and RS-485). But I have no clue how fast those meters and fixture will respond to load demand.

@grfloater

Why not put an 1p-AC-PV with up to 3.5kWp on the garage and the MP2/Battery into the house?

Than you can blast up to 4kW MP2 and 3.5 kW AC-PV into your house.

You can have the AC-PV on ACout helping the loads on ACout while offgrid.

I have this configuration with 3p and my AC-PV is 20m “away” on the roof.

A single panel MPPT would help with black start if needed.

I have HMS-2000-4T and HMS-1000-2T on a single phase on ACout1.

Btw the relay on ACout2 can be controlled via relay assistant. I keep it closed while off grid and open when SOC is below 20%.

That’s a very nice idea… I was thinking of something similar, you put down the numbers and wrapped up everything nice!
My concern was/is that the house is of very limited space, also I worry about the humming noise of MPII. The owner proposed to house everything (MPII, battery) outside, to build a mini weather protected shelf (like those that enclose the grid meters). Of course, all these (AC-PV, shelter) raise the cost, but I will propose to the owner. Having the MPII very close to mains panel, means grid metering, also controlling via ACout2 loads etc.

Maybe this is the solution, as you propose, something like 800-1600W PV-AC (HMS) on storage building, plus a 400W (12V) or 800W (24V) or 1200W (48V battery) PV-DC on house roof. Going for 48V LiFePo, I need at least 70V input to mppt, better 3 panels in series - which makes it complex, for that roof installation. Most pro I will forget the PV-DC for black start and work on something to trickle charge from mains the LiFePo.

@grfloater

I have 48V with SmartMPPT 150/45 with 4 panels Trina Vertex S+ 425Wp 2p2s. Works great.

Most “standard” panels have 34-42V, but at low temperature raising above 150V with 3s. Use Victron MPPT calculator.

The HMS increase efficiency as they pump AC with 96% to my (managed) loads like a water heating element.

About the noise…

Use this rubber plugs to isolate from the wall. I did not check the size.

Use PWM controlled 80mm fan with a temperature control device (5 EUR from CN) to force airflow.

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