MY-PV Thor, Ohm-pilot or DIY water heating?

Good afternoon,

In 2016 we installed a self engineered system that works on the output frequency shift of a Victron inverter (3 Quattros) to heat the water.
We installed a Trumeter APM frequency meter, an Akytec TRM-210 PID process controller and 3 Fadisel R-27 5000W choppers connected to 3x2000W coils in one of the two 1000 litre “hot” tanks.
The PV field inverters we programmed to reduce power only above 51Hz, instead of the usual 50,20Hz.
The PID controller we programmed to keep the frequency in between 50,06 and 50,08Hz, so all the excess PV power will go in the hot water and the PV inverters keep producing the maximum possible.
This starts normally around 1300-1500 till sun down, as then our batteries are getting full and the Quattros want to reduce the PV power by raising the frequency, but instead water is heated.
We placed an extra APM frequency meter in the kitchen, so the “ladies” there would know when to switch on washing machines as these meters can be programmed to change colour, “red” not wash, “green” wash, even flashing if needed.
The results are in after 8 years of use, 1500 KWh in average each year, this with 8 KWp PV panels which generated 9000 KWh a year in average, meaning, at about 330 Euro savings a year if we had to buy that energy.

Just when we mounted this installation the Ohm-pilot was invented (2017-isch), but this one had/has only 1 proportional output and the other 2 are switched fully on/off.
The inverter phase connected to that proportional regulated coil is doing 80-90% of the work all year long, and not keeping the 3 phases in balance, for single phase no issues there.
Also it cannot be used without “again” a smart meter to see that nothing goes to the grid…

Then the MY-PV Thor was invented (2018-isch), mainly the 9S (3 phase) was of our interest, 3 phases fully proportional, frequency control and can be used with a smart meter, that’s cool we thought.

But, we lost quickly interest in both machines and even in our DIY made one…runs fine btw.
Why, easy, this amount of 1500 KWh for hot water was actually only a drip into the ocean, this as we also have 16KW vacuum tubes, generating 48000 KWh a year average and besides that, we use 2 pieces 75KW wood incinerators who deliver 40000 KWh a year average.
We thought that we “lost” way more energy due to the reduction of our panels, but it is not that much.
So, the safed energy with such device is not worth the investment, as it can take years of use to get it back in the pocket, also, it generates/saves only 1.5% on our hot water use per year in average.

Basically all 3 systems as above described are around a 1500-2500 Euro to build/install by yourself as it’s not just the controls part, but also the water coils, cabling, fuses, etc.
Well, with a return of 330 Euro per year on such investment in our case, that takes about 5-8 years before it starts to make a profit…maintenance and/or defects not calculated.
Over dimensioning the PV field was opted by us, but then again, more investment, and the risc that the frequency starts to limit the PV field inverters as well, and to have to set the clocks once a week correct…no…
For that investment it would be better to buy extra/bigger batteries or 1-2 extra vacuum tube panels is our conclusion as we do not deliver to the grid.

One big advantage of the TRM-210 is that it will keeps the frequency between 50,06 and 50,08Hz, unlike the PV inverters, which reduce only according a certain amount of power against frequency, having to set clocks all the time due to the high frequency, never late for work do…
Just for that I would advise to install such system.

Regards, Jeroen.

Is this a question or a ‘product presentation’? :thinking:

Good morning Steffen,

I like to see what other people think of these systems, therefore, I explained what we made, used, and what are the results after 8 years.
Hopefully others have these similar systems as well, so we can learn from each other and share usage experiences and results.
In 2016, when we designed the system we were actually first running on some obsolete analogue boards from a ships propulsion system we had laying around, perfectly proportional, but very outdated and very very expensive, so we opted for off the shelf products as written above.
It can be made with many other elements, it just what you prefer to use.
The above PID is now not made anymore, but many others are available, why we chose this TRM, it auto adjusts itself, very very handy, why the APM, completely adjustable, great screen, why the R-27s, standard electronics, easy to repair, as these are the “work horses”.
In the old community, I remember many people with “fast” running clocks, that problem we had also that time, but that we do not have anymore since we installed this system, as written above, thats a big win, for the costs not so much.

Regards, Jeroen.

:grinning: that should not be a criticism at all :slight_smile: That’s what this is supposed to be for

A few days ago there was just a ‘product presentation’ for a very inexpensive ‘modified’ 3-phase Shelly relay which could be integrated almost arbitrarily into the ‘’‘excess control’‘’ … so almost ready to use …

Good morning Steffen,

Yes of course, thanks for the “Shelly tip”, I’ve checked it.
That is not working on the frequency shift, nor with excess power from PV panels as I understood.
Nice to see btw.

Regards, Jeroen.