Multiplus II 5000 on-grid charger off

[Logic28 (Mauro Andreini)]

Is there a way to selectively stop/pause the internal battery charger wile AC1 in is active and feeding the loads while the inverter is set to the “ON” mode without interfering with the Amperage, just a simple charger On/Off?

I wish to do so via Node-Red ether through a Victron’s pallet node (which only seem to be available for MPPT charger) or via an Assistant, either way Node-Red would be the decision making device.

Setting the Amperage to 0 or 1 always locks it to 2A and that can cause the inverter to oscillate between Bulk and Passthough which is undesirable.

Thanks

[fredvduin (Fredd)]

@Logic28

just a simple charger On/Off?

Does Inverter Only not work

[nickdb (Nick)]

@Logic28

s there a way to selectively stop/pause the internal battery charger wile AC1 in is active and sfeeding the loads while the inverter is set to the “ON” mode without interfering with the Amperage, just a simple charger On/Off?

There is no internal charger.
The Multiplus is a converter that switches between either inverting or charging, it does one or the other, never both.

[chrigu]

@Logic28

Setting the Amperage to 0 or 1 always locks it to 2A

I guess you mean the ACin current limit here? The lower limit is due to PowerAssist. With PowerAssist deactivated you should be able to set the ACin current limit to zero.

You can limit the charge current in DVCC. Setting it to zero will effectively disable charging.

Setting the VE.Bus mode to Inverter only like Fredd described should also work, but theres a chance that the system physically disconnects from the grid. Havent tested that yet myself.

Ive also seen a charge power limit in ESS. At least i believe i saw that, but i cant find it anymore now. Probably was in the beta version, but my beta system is offline currently.

[Logic28 (Mauro Andreini)]

I suppose it would be the simplest way, I was merely avoiding using the batteries at night and if they are almost full, avoid charging but allow the grid to feed the loads

[Logic28 (Mauro Andreini)]

Are you saying that in the ON position it will charge the batteries and not feed power to the loads directly from ACin to ac out? if so is that why the passthrough exists? I never looked into this as my Multi is always in the “ON” position. I found this documentation which would confirm my understanding. _ An AC voltage connected to the ‘AC in’ terminal will be switched through to the ‘AC out’ terminal, if within specifications. The inverter will switch off, the ‘mains on’ LED will light up, and the charger commences charging.”

Victron Energy

+1

[nickdb (Nick)]

No.
(the forum now translates languages so perhaps use your native language to post, makes it less likely to be misunderstood).

In the ON position the system is free to either operate as an inverter or a battery charger.
Mains will be passed through if it’s charging or used to top-up loads if the inverter is being limited, though typically in an ESS the shortfall comes from battery until the inverter runs out of steam.

[dmajwool (David Woolley)]

@Logic28

, I was merely avoiding using the batteries at night and if they are almost full, avoid charging but allow the grid to feed the loads

The way I would do that is by setting up a scheduled charge in the ESS section.
You can set days of the week , a start time and a duration, and set a “charge from grid until SoC = x%”. If you set x to something low, like 10%, then the system won’t actually do much charging, but the loads will be fed from the grid for the duration of the event.
You can set x so that you reach your desired SoC for the morning and hold it there.
If your batteries are higher than x% at the start of the event, then that is where they will stay without any charging taking place.

[Logic28 (Mauro Andreini)]

@dmajwool

You can set x so that you reach your desired SoC for the morning and hold it there.
If your batteries are higher than x% at the start of the event, then that is where they will stay without any charging taking place.

That would simply duplicate what I have already done in Node-Red besides, I am off grid and I was under the understanding that ESS is only used in conjunction with grid-tied systems.

This is one of my 11 tabs for many different tabs of flows, amongst which predictive charging according to Solcast prediction.

All I neeed is to have the ability to switch off the charging when the batteries will non necessitate so but stil run the loads from the incoming grid energy which is only used for charging, just like an appliance.

The Auto-ON-OFF switch is reacting to the forecast and it is kind of doing so already. I’am exploring other avenues a little more precise.

Doing so by meens of the Amperage (allready auto-calculated by my flow) would permit oscillations between Bulk and Passthrough when the used energy is around 3/4A. I simply need to use the flow to stop charging altogether until a new permission is fired.

I’m sure that one of the assistants will have that function and that was essentially what I was looking for.

[dmajwool (David Woolley)]

@Logic28

Is there a way to selectively stop/pause the internal battery charger wile AC1 in is active and sfeeding the loads

@Logic28

besides, I am off grid and I was under the understanding that ESS is only used in conjunction with grid-tied systems.

Sorry for my misunderstanding. When you said your ACin is active I assumed you were on-grid. My understanding is that ACin is not active in off-grid systems.

[Logic28 (Mauro Andreini)]

Understood,

Essentially all I’m trying to do is to prevent the typical oscillation between on and passthrough of the inverter, also frequently mentioned here by other users, mostly due to the Multi not being able to set the amperage to 0 but instead always returning it to a value of 2. Obviously when the value is set to 2 A or any other low value, once the loads reach about the same amount of consumption, here is where the problem starts and here is what I would rather interrupt the charger until the values are substantially above the threshold.

[dmajwool (David Woolley)]

@Logic28

I am off grid and I was under the understanding that ESS is only used in conjunction with grid-tied systems.

… but stil run the loads from the incoming grid energy which is only used for charging, just like an appliance.

Please can you clarify whether your system is grid-tied or off-grid. You seem to be claiming both.

[Logic28 (Mauro Andreini)]

An AC voltage connected to the ‘AC in’ terminal will be switched through to the ‘AC out’ terminal, if within specifications. The inverter will switch off, the ‘mains on’ LED will light up, and the charger commences charging.

Why did you say NO to this?

I think there may be a misunderstanding here, so let me clarify.

This is precisely what the MultiPlus-II manual states in section 3.1, On/Off/Charger Only Switch.

When switched to On, the inverter/charger is fully functional. When acceptable AC is connected to AC-in, it is passed through to AC-out, the inverter switches off, and the charger commences charging.

When the switch is switched to ‘charger only’, only the battery charger of the inverter/charger will operate (if mains voltage is present). The input voltage is also switched through to the ‘AC out’ terminal in this mode.

I never suggested that the inverter should invert and charge simultaneously. I understand that these are distinct operating functions. I simply quoted the manual, which explicitly states that grid power can pass through to AC-out while the battery charger operates.

My question has always been straightforward:

Is there a way to switch the battery charger section on and off while the MultiPlus-II remains in On mode, with acceptable AC connected to AC-in and passed through to AC-out to supply the loads?

I want to interrupt battery charging when appropriate without interrupting grid pass-through. I thought I had made that distinction clear.

That is the specific question I’d like answered. Explanations about the inverter and charger performing their respective conversion functions do not answer it.

[nickdb (Nick)]

So, in veconfigure you can disable the charger. This cannot be done dynamically or via an integration.
You are stuck with adjusting the limits, which is not the binary behaviour you are looking for.
With a managed battery you can override (lower) the CVL in DVCC which would effectively stop charging or even force a discharge.

[Logic28 (Mauro Andreini)]

Thanks,

I assumed that one of the assistant could do that, allowing me to remotely control it via node-red, perhaps via the cerbo GX relay directly connected to the MP2 Aux input 2 (since I alredy use input 1 for the Ignore ACin flag).

[Logic28 (Mauro Andreini)]

No need to apologise, sometimes it’s not as straightforward as it seems trying to explain your intentions which seems to be by case here

An AC voltage connected to the ‘AC in’ terminal will be switched through to the ‘AC out’ terminal, if within specifications. The inverter will switch off, the ‘mains on’ LED will light up, and the charger commences charging. The ‘bulk’, ‘absorption’ or ‘float’ LEDs will light up, depending on the charger mode.

If the voltage at the ‘AC-in’ terminal is rejected, the inverter will switch on.

When the switch is switched to ‘charger only’, only the battery charger of the inverter/charger will operate (if mains voltage is present). The input voltage is also switched through to the ‘AC out’ terminal in this mode.

You can steel selectively use the AC in either for supplying the loads, charging or both.

[kaarliskr]

If you set ESS to external control, but then don’t actually control it, the Multiplus will go into passthrough and will simply power loads from the grid. I don’t know what will happen if grid is lost tho.

Sadly, this will also disable solar chargers.

[dmajwool (David Woolley)]

@Logic28

Is there a way to switch the battery charger section on and off while the MultiPlus-II remains in On mode, with acceptable AC connected to AC-in and passed through to AC-out to supply the loads?

Yes, use scheduled charging within the ESS assistant as I indicated above.
The scheduled charge sessions can be configured via NodeRed if you so wish.

[Logic28 (Mauro Andreini)]

Thanks,

I was not aware that you could use the ESS if you are in island mode and you only connect to the grid for a few hours on low tariff and only deep in the winter.

I’ll have to study the ESS and understand how it works so it doesn’t create conflicts with my current assistant whichis set to ingnore ACin untill the Gen command from cerbo allows so, and /or my full Node-Red set up.

[dmajwool (David Woolley)]

@Logic28

only connect to the grid for a few hours on low tariff

I don’t know how you might implement this connection and disconnection in a fixed installation, and why you feel the need to do so?

But Victron is endlessly configurable and you may well have developed a killer feature.

My grid-tied system has ACin permanently connected to the grid and just the same as your use-case I do zero charging from grid spring summer and autumn. This works. My draw from the grid is normally way less than 0.1kWh/day and this “leakage” is attributable to fast switching loads - particularly an induction hot-plate hob cooker.

Without these difficult loads the MP2 will only draw from the grid when the loads are beyond its KVA capacity. Period.

Staying connected to the grid has the advantage for me that surplus PV can be exported to the grid and earn money. If I was in island mode I would lose that opportunity.

In the winter months I use ESS scheduled charge periods during low tariff times to bring the battery up to a chosen SoC and run the system direct from grid.

This is all a very simple use-case anticipated by Victron. I don’t see the advantage to expand on your 11 pages of NodeRed to achieve things that are available in the core product. The core product is well tested and supported.

My motto : KISS.