My Orion Tr Smart 12/12-30 Charger runs hot, and the output current folds back considerably. Anyone else with this problem? When cold, it will output 33A. When hot, it will fold back to 26A or less. Parts of the case may exceed 134dg F, in a cool (60dg F) environment. By adding a 80CFM fan above the fins, the case temperature is lowered by 20 degrees F, and the unit will continuosly output 30A. It would appear that the heat sink is undersized. Comments?
We have a Winnebago View 2021 with 2 Victron 100ah lithium batteries. The data sheet states that model HG2040 and later will shut off automatically if temps are too cold but I don't know if our model has this feature. SN is HQ2022B8LE1 and PN is BAT512110705. Thank you!
I had a scenario where the batteries told the ve.bus BMS "allow to charge:NO" because the battery temperature was below 5°C - well one battery was, see my unanswered question here: https://community.victronenergy.com/questions/34077/smartlithium-battery-temperature-sensor-believable.html
Since I never got an answer for this, I am using the BMS and the temperature of the battery as measured internally as the "source of all knowledge" to control the chargers, rather than the temperature reported by the BMV-712.
This in turn turned off the battery protect on the charger side (I have 1x BlueSolar 150/70 and 2x SmartSolar 150/35 there)
All good so far.
However, when the temperature increased, and the BMS changed to "allow to charge:YES" the Battery Protect (configured in Li-ion mode) eventually went to error E1 - short circuit.
When I measured the voltage on the charger side of the BP it was ~30V - battery side was ~26V.
I then disabled the chargers using Victron Connect, restarted the battery protect by removing and replacing the remote connection from the BMS, waited until the BP had configured, then restarted the chargers one by one.
The system came up.
Obviously I don’t want to have to do this every time the system shuts down due to low temperature.
Any help appreciated.
About to install an Easysolar II gx system in my mountain cottage in Norway (-37 C this winter). My first off grid move and the fact of there being Victron is amazing. Thx!!
To make it as clear as possible: my question is NOT about charge or discharge but solely about idle storage aka long term effects of freezing electrolytes (freeze point being -30/35 C)
Neither interested in battery heating nor LTO solutions
Most LFP manufacturers define cold storage limit as: -20C
Only Victron and Mastervolt (which both use Winston cells (LYP) spec the batteries to -45C
Failed finding any real test data except one very interesting study that shows that deep freeze ( cryogenic freezing ) got no harmful effect.
This study does not address temperature-fluctuations around freeze point, and only measures short term effects. http://wrap.warwick.ac.uk/119502/13...erflash-cryogenic-freezing-Grandjean-2019.pdf.
It does match my understanding though that the electrolytes do NOT expand when it freezes (unlike water). If so any LFP battery would actually survive sub -30C temperatures ! ?
....this is a technical fringe question and I could just go with the winston/victron/lyp solution but if someone got the science/information I would really appreciate!
the best to you all, Nilo
Recently my BMS disabled charging due to low temperature (at approximately 2021-03-17 0710 hrs) and as a result the batteries fully discharged. When I realized this, I raised the temperature to the point at which they could charge, but the Multipluses would not charge the batteries. The VE.bus BMS was not preventing them from charging the batteries and yet the inverter-chargers showed "off" on my Cerbo GX.
I tried completely shutting everything down and disconnecting the batteries from all loads and then powering it all back up multiple times, to no effect.
What I thought might be happening is that there was some kind of internal "minimum charger restart voltage" that was not being met since the batteries were down to about 11V. So I hooked my truck up to the trailer and used the 7-pin auxiliary power circuit (which is wired to an Orion 12/12-18 charger) to charge up the batteries. Several hours later (at approximately 2021-03-18 2023 hrs), when the batteries hit about 12.9V, the Multipluses started back up and began charging the batteries. Now everything appears normal.
Can anyone explain this behavior? Specifically, why didn't my Multipluses start charging the batteries once the VE.bus BMS allowed them to as a result of the batteries exceeding their "minimum allow-to-charge temperature"?
Here is a link to the error codes (which I cannot find in any of the VE.bus or Multiplus documentation, Victron Toolkit, etc.) that the Multipluses were flashing while the problem was occurring:
Here is a link to my VRM portal:
And here are a couple of screenshots of my inverter and charger configuration. Thanks in advance for any assistance:
Hi there guys,
I have two SmartSolar MPPT 250/85s. They get pretty hot in the day and seem like they are throttling. I would like to automate a 48V fan to cool them. I have Node-Red set up and looking through the options, there is no way to read the internal temp of the MPPT. It clearly has a sensor for throttling. Does anyone know how to access this or why it would not be made available?
Just asking for some confirmation of what I believe I am seeing here,
This data is showing the quattro temp derating in AC coupled mode correct? The stepping of the AC output frequency and corresponding PV inverter yield coincides with the temperature warnings. The co-located MPPT yield is not throttled, the batteries are at ~65% (LA) and are in absorption, however the throttling is seeing the voltage not holding.
To me the device looks like its heat saturated, The PV Inverter reductions are too symmetrical and correspond with the temp warnings to be clouds.
It would be great if there was an indication the unit was derating or a internal temp sensor to verify.
So have a little more info from the site, the fans in the unit are slowly winding up then try to go to full speed and shutoff, this happens at exactly the same time the unit derates.
This leads me to believe that the power bus that runs the fans is exceeding its current and shutting down. Maybe by a self resetting fuse?
This unit runs a small island so sending the unit away will have problems.
It is possible for victron staff to look at any more internal data via the console to possibly determine the issue?
I have 4 LiFePo4 90Ah batteries that are about 6 years old. They are not the smart model, but do have BTV leads to connect to a VEBus BMS.
The system will be setup in a location where on occasion the batteries could experience temperatures of 0deg C.
I will be purchasing a smartshunt in order to measure consumption/soc etc.
If I purchase the temp sensor for the smartshunt, will this cut the charging current from both multiplus and victron mppt if the temperature drops below 0deg C?
I also have a Color Control GX that will be installed with the system and connected to the smartshunt and mppt via V.E direct. The CCGX will also be connected to the multiplus via V.E Bus.
Hi everyone! Thanks for looking at my question!
I have a 600Ah Battery bank (2x RB300LT batteries from Relion) The batteries are specifically designed for low temperatures with built in heating elements, controlled by the BMS.
Are there any specific inverter settings that would optimize safely charging these batteries during low temperatures? And, if so, when the temperatures warm up, would I need to modify these settings?
Ideally, I would like to be able to set a range, and not for the seasons if possible.
Inverter: Victron Multiplus Compact 12v/2000w/80amp
Batteries: 2x RB300LT batteries Relion
B2B: Sterling 60Amp (1260 model)
Alternators: 2x Factory Installed 230Amp alternators
My Blue Smart IP67 12/25 Charger housing reaches 140 degrees F (as measured with one of those laser temp guns) when charging my 100AH LiFePO4 battery at 25A for an extended period. Pretty much too hot to touch. Ambient temp perhaps 77 degrees. Is this expected and normal? Charging has worked fine for a number of cycles, but I'm nervous about premature failure due to excessive heat.
I didn't realize that 8% inefficiency (the corollary of 92% efficient) could generate this much heat. Not being trained in this area, I don't know how to calculate expected heat generation from power conversion inefficiency.
Boston area Sprinter camper van, parked outdoors all year, with pretty cold winters. In order to best protect the batteries, should I leave the BMS on to manage the battery function or should I turn all the fuses off to avoid any drainage or charging? Should the batteries be fully charged or drained? Any advice on heating pads? Thx
We have bought a boat with a 3 month old 12/3000/120 Victron installed. The previous owner explained that we should run our engine to charge our batteries using two pieces of electronics - a Dometic travelpower kit and the Victron.
We turn on the engine, power up the Dometic and the Victron then goes through its bulk, absorption, float process. We keep an eye on the Dometic and when the screen shows we have reach 0.1W (from a start point of 1.7W usually) and the Victron is at least in absorption, we switch it all off and the batteries are fully charged. Since we had the batteries cleaned up, we haven't hit float regardless of how long we run the process for (beforehand it was going into float far too quickly but not holding a charge).
In the past week, when we go through the process, with the engine on, the Dometic doing its thing and the Victron on, the temperature light has begun to flash on the Victron. We thought this was due to the cupboard confining the Victron so have put a fan on it to keep the space cool but this only delays the temperature light flashing. The past two days, not only has the temperature light flashed but the absorption and float lights have flashed simultaneously. When this has happened, the Dometic display shows we are down to 0.1W so it looks like the batteries are close to being fully charged (even though it's much less time taken than previously - maybe after only half an hour).
This began when a Betamarine engineer told my partner that the optimum revs to charge the batteries was 1200 which was higher than we had been running the engine at before (about 900 revs). We wondered if the temperature light flashing was connected to the higher revs so have pulled the engine revs back again but the temperature light is still flashing. The only other difference is that my partner topped up the water levels of the batteries a few days ago - and the temperature light wasn't flashing before he did that.
Anyone have any idea why these lights have started flashing?
I am installing a Victron BMW 712 in my RV
I have 2 x litium batteries in parallel.
I will want to install the temperature sensor for the BMW712.
To wich battery do I mount the temp sensor to, or can I install 1 temp sensor for each battery?
I am now facing the problem of charging the LITHIUM batteries below 5 celsius on one of our rural sites, so my question is that:
how can we view the battery cell temperature online using the VRM or any other method? so not to be forced to go to the site and check it locally using the VICTRONCONNECT app
Does the BMV-7xx's "Temperature Coefficient" setting just improve SOC readings, or in a networked configuration does it also have some influence on a Solar MPPT and it's "Temperature Compensation" setting?
For Lithium batteries, the recommendation seems to be BMV Temperature Coefficient = 0.9% cap/F and MPPT Temperature Compensation = Disabled. I was just wanting to make sure a BMV Coefficient setting will not override a MPPT Compensation setting.
My PSC IP43 charger is setup to stop charging the LiFePO4 battery when temperature drops below 5°C. It uses data from BMV712 via smart network to get battery temp.
The charger did shut down at 4°C as expected. But it does not restart even after heating the battery compartment up to 8°C.
Is this a bug in the charger firmware or did I miss something?
[image]Pylontech batteries sitting at 15c degrees on ccgx,however the VRM is indicating -273 c degrees!
I have recently hooked up my BMV712/MPPT Solar to VRM portal via VenusOS - its really great and loving it so far.
I have battery temp being fed into the network by Smart Battery temp sensors. And this works as I can see Batt Temp on the solar? (or was it the BMV?)
Anyway - I was wondering if I am doing something wrong as despite the battery temp being on the network, it is not passed through to VRM.
The service batteries are located in the engine compartment. However, the temperature (read on the Cerbo Touch pad and from the Smart Shunt) is consistently about five degrees Celsius lower than other temperature meters. Can I compensate for this? Thanks in advance.
simple question - what can I do to bring the temp of my inverter/reg and batteries down (running easysolar 48/5000 w/ 10kw BYD lithium). Can I bring the inverter units fans on prior factory setting? other options?
I have all Victron kit; BVM-712, Orion-Tr Smart DC-DC, MPPT 75/15, Smart IP65 AC-DC charger and the separate smart sense battery temperature monitor sitting on top of my LiFePO4 battery in a camper van.
The Aux input of the 712 is used for the starter battery. Conscious of the 5C temperature charging threashold I added the Smart Sense Battery temperature sensor. I have linked this to the VE Network.
Does the Smart Sense Battery temperature offer the same functionality as the directly connected [to the BVM 712] version? That is, it will prevent the solar charger from charging the battery if below 5C?
Will it also prevent the Smart IP65 from charging the battery if connected to shore power?
I was never planning to use my van during the winter, so when I built it this wasn’t thought-out.
Now I am using it regularly in these colder temperatures I want to make sure my system is working efficiently.
I am planning to buy a 100Ah LiFePo4 battery for my RV, and manage/use it with a Multiplus 1600VA inverter/charter and Orion-Tr battery-to-battery charger.
I have read the manual for the multiplus and orion, and can see that they can limit charging when the battery gets too hot...which is nice, but I am unable to see if they can stop charging when the battery is below zero degrees. Can they? :)
I have a temperature probe connected directly to my Venus hub and it is used to monitor the general temperature inside the battery compartment on my RV. I had set up an alarm rule to warn of low temperature but realized I had set it up incorrectly. I deleted the Alarm Rule but now the temperature probe does not show up on the drop down list for selecting devices for Alarm Rules. I checked the Venus device but it just shows Internal Temperature as an option. How do I get the temperature probe back so I can set up an Alarm Rule?
HI I have 3 x 48/15000 Quattro units 3 Phase connected wit Solar MD lithium Batteries 50Kwh capacity. Busy testing the system .
The Temperature Alarm keeps on coming up when we pull loads of at least 10Kw per phase . The temp coming out of the units does not feel excessive as well we have a Air-conditioning system in the room . I try to establish at which temperature the Quattro triggers as this is of major concern now , and I do not have any of these issues on other units running definitely at higher temperatures.
Will appreciate assistance in this regard
Hi 12VMan (and Victron staff please). I found your thread on Lithium battery protect settings while searching, but decided my comment should be a new question.
Thanks for your answer in that thread, mentioning that Victron lithium batteries issue a temperature alert at 5C. This gets my attention. My research to date was indicating that lithium batteries are OK for charging down to around 1C (and for discharging well below 0C, as an aside). I need to pursue this, as I'm planning to use Victron LiFePO4 batteries in Arctic conditions, in an expedition yacht that will be static for days to a week or two. Water temps will be down to around 2-3C, sometimes lower depending on icing. I'm looking into the need for heating for the battery box, which will be under the insulated floorboards and so outside of the primary heated spaces. If 5C is the real deal, I need to get serious with calculations on battery energy that might be consumed in making the batteries warm enough to be chargeable. Or other heating.
So, where is this 5C figure coming from? OK, I see +5C mentioned in the 12.8V LiFePO4 battery data sheet.
This prompts a few specific and important questions, about the Victron 12.8V 300Ah variants:
1. What is the lower internal battery temperature at which the battery signals to a connected BMS that charging is not permitted?
2. If the answer to Q1 is different than +5C, what is the consequence in terms of battery health (and charging efficiency?) of charging occurring between the two temperatures?
3. Does the answer to Q2 depend on the rate of charging?
4. If the internal battery temperature is just high enough for the battery to allow itself to be charged, and in this case at a low rate of 20A per battery (80A from a normal alternator, shared between 4 batteries), will this charging slowly warm the batteries up such that a higher rate of charging can be initiated in due course?
5. At what battery temperature (measured by a sensor on the positive terminal, or is there a way to get the internal temperature?) can high rate charging at ~150A per battery be initiated, such that no appreciable damage to battery health occurs? Would it be prudent to step the charging rate up slowly as the batteries warm up?
Clearly, it will be helpful if I rig a temperature sensor for the battery box, to guide appropriate action before each charging session.
The boat will use an Integrel On-Engine Charger (basically a big and very efficient second alternator) which can charge at up to a very high rate. Or it can be turned off so that charging is via the engine's standard alternator only. I might need to raise the battery box temperature before starting to charge each week or so. Heat from the main engine during these charging events will then help.
Thank you for your help with these questions. :-)
I m having this alarm in my CC GX "sensor temperature error". And I can see on VE. Bus System Battery Temperature widget a temperature peak of 54 °C.
I have a EES with a MPPT and a Quattro. In my settings I got my batteries at 100% SOC. Also I got zero feed in. So the batteries are not supposed to discharge and the energy generated helps the loads.
Why are the batteries overheating???
Below are several iOS VictonConnect screens show seemingly significant Battery Temperature differences.
The Multiplus shows 96 and the Smart Lithium displays 94.
Ich habe ganz neu einen Phoenix Smart Inverter 12/1600.
Direkt nach der Installation beim ersten mal einschalten, fàngt er an 2x zu blinken(grùn/rot).
Die app teilt mir "Temperatur zu niedrig" an. Die Raumtemperatur hat ca.23 GradC, das kann doch nicht sein. Bin nach Anleitung gegangen.
Ausserdem fàllt mir auf, das alle 3(L/N/PE) eine Verbindung zueinander haben, was ja einen Kurzschluss gleich kommt, ist das im ausgeschalteten/nicht funktionierenden Zustand normal?
Short form in English:
I bought a new Inverter and installed it yesterday, but it won't work, it's blinking twice and the App tells me "temperature too low".