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system design

Victron Multiplus 1600 and 4 x Superpack 100Ah - Design sanity check plse

This is a design for a solution that will NOT be integrated in a VAN power system (read alternator) and the 4 x Victron 100Ah superpacks were chosen because of space restrictions and specific desire not to have additional BMS equipment. All main loads are 12V e.g. lights, fridge, boiler etc and will be connected via a fuse/switch panel and the only 230V requirement is for a kettle/hairdryer and coffee grinder ;) and to charge the batteries from shore when required.

My question. Does it look right and how best can I protect the Superpacks (which will be installed under the bed in the van) from charging damage at low temperatures when passing through the Nordics?


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ejrossouw asked
ejrossouw commented ·

1 Answer

Smart Solar MPPT / Cerbo / Pylontech. Will they work without any other equip for dc only loads ?

Hi,

I am looking at using a Pylontech US3000 battery for an off grid system which only has dc loads.

Planned system will be 1 or 2 x Smart Solar MPPT's connected to Cerbo via VE direct, and Cerbo connected to the Pylontech Battery via CAN connection (type B cable per manual).

Q1. Is there any need for an inverter/charger (such as Multiplus) or am I ok to delete this since I don't have any ac loads ?

Q2. Will I need a shunt (Lynx shunt) to connect to the Cerbo to measure battery current for correct operation and SOC monitoring ?

Is there anything else I should be aware of ?

Regards

Scott

ScottR asked
Neoman answered ·

1 Answer

Can a Multiplus 24/5000 run a 2.2kW SCUBA compressor?

Hi all.

I'm currently designing a system for my sail boat that I would like to run a Bauer Junior II dive compressor (2.2kW) from a Multiplus 24/5000. My research so far has indicated that people typically spec a 8-9kW generator to handle the start up current of the compressor. In my case, I won't have any generator.

My research has dug up anecdotal evidence of a 5kW inverter (unknown brand) starting a Junior II with a smart softstart from Hyper Engineering. I'm hoping that Victron inverters, given their capability to do 200% for 30 cycles should be able to start the compressor without issue, however I'd like to be a little more certain before dropping the $$$.

Does anyone know of this being done successfully?

Could the MP 5k still start it, even if the ambient temperatures are a bit higher (40ºC)?

Any help is greatly appreciated.

Regards,

Justin


@Botnic How is yours going?

JustMurph asked
JustMurph commented ·

4 Answers

EasySolar 48/5000 - system

Hello! I'm new to solar and i want to create a pv system with a EasySolar 48/5000. I have 16 pcs. - 360w mono panels. It will be an off grid system with at least 5kw LifePo batteries (non victron 3,2v, 120A- 16 pcs ). My question is, what BMS do you recommend? Can i use the system without a BMS? What other components from victron i need? Thanks.

Catalin Moraru asked
Murray van Graan answered ·

1 Answer

Choosing between one large inverter or two smaller for US 120-0-120 split phase

We're getting ready to install a new Victron setup at home. The old Trace (before Xantrex even !) finally died, and upgrading is in the winds ...

Being in the US, we need 120-0-120 split phase of course. Can anyone show the pros and cons between the two options here ?

* One large 230V Quattro to take in 240V from grid, 240V from gen (neutral not connected), spit out 240V to 100A autotransformer to sub-panel for two L1/L2 120V supplies.

* Two smaller 120V Quattro to take in 120V each from the two grid L1/L2 legs, and L1/L2 from gen, spit out two L1/L2 120V legs to sub-panel.

Halfwalker asked
Halfwalker edited ·

5 Answers

Small solar system ongrid configuration

Hello,

I am totally new to this matter. I want to install a small solar system with a battery and feed my house grid with the generated power.

I am thinking of using 2x 320Wp panel with 2x MPPT BlueSolar 75/15, a battery (unsure which size), and an inverter - maybe Phoenix 24/250 230V VE.direct?

And to monitor all that stuff I would need a device which is able to handle 3 VE.direct devices - so I would need a Cerbo GX?

Maybe someone with better knowledge can have a quick look and advice me.

Thank you, Jorge

tossa-fan asked
ejrossouw commented ·

2 Answers

Need Schematics for my expedition vehicle

All,


I have knowledge of Solar system but not as detail. I am building my own van and identified below

major Victron products. I need a comprehensive diagram/schematic that show all equipment, wiring connections including, busbars, protection devices, fuses, batteries, voltage regulators, switches and etc. I like to create Bill of Material out of this schematic and use for the installation.

Your help is appreciated in advance

Major equipment

Lithium-Ion Battery Bank(s)- 2 parallel banks, 24V

Total usable battery capacity - 800Ah,20Kwh,24 Volt

Battery Management System - BMS Control Unit

Solar panel - 1 each large, 0.3kW

Solar panels- 4 each medium, 0.24kW (2 parallel sets)

Max. solar power - 1.3kW

MPPT solar controllers- 1x 150/35A + 1x 100/15A

Energy Color Control GX Panels

Charge rate (max.)- 28V, 120A

IDC/AC Inverter - Quattro 24V/5000VA/120

Inputs besides panels

1- Truck Alternator - 24V

2- Shore power - 230 V

3- Generator- 230 V

Output Voltages:

1- Stabilized 24V

2- Stabilized 12V

3- 24V


Kazim asked
Kevin Windrem answered ·

5 Answers

Car 12v dual battery solar and alternator charge

Hi

Keen on Victron

Looking for confirmation, and a wiring diagram

Having a DCDC charger and solar regulator is OK but I don't think I can run them together with solar and alternator.

First battery is a lead acid for starting the motor and the second battery is a lithium.

Can charge a 12v car dual battery system with both solar and alternator?

Other DCDC chargers are combined and do this

Peter asked
TrinasGarden answered ·

2 Answers

Hi: I need to design 12kw solar systems with 24x2v OPZS 2900 (200kg with acide wt); 3 phase with grid and generator connectcion.

Hi:

GRID IS:

380 - 415 Volt 3-phase at 50 Hz.


-15KW Solar

-24 batteries x 2volt (OPZS 2900 ... must be 200kg or more per battery when acid full)

-3 Phase solar inverter

-3 phase battery inverters

-380/3phase (400 x 3 phase)

380 - 415 Volt 3-phase at 50 Hz.

-Generator connection (25KVA)


dimetk asked
Justin Cook - Bay Marine Supply USA answered ·

2 Answers

Can a tripped breaker on SCC output damage the SCC?

I have a SmartSolar 250/100, which has a breaker on the PV input. I am reading that I should also place a breaker between the SCC and battery bus bar, matched to the SCC/cable amp rating.

I have been cautioned repeatedly to turn off PV input before disconnecting battery power or damage to the SCC would quickly ensue. This has me wondering...

If the breaker between the SCC and bus bar trips, disconnecting the batteries from the SCC, and the PV input remains connected, will this damage the SCC?

I searched for an answer, but did not find it. If I missed it, please link the thread and I will gladly go read up on it!

RickP asked
RickP commented ·

1 Answer

How is "recommended number of cells in series for highest controller efficiency" (section 3.3 of smartsolar manual) determined?

I would like to understand the math or logic behind these recommendations. I understand that 'cells in series' is shorthand for operating voltage.


I assume that this calculation is a balance between maximizing voltage differential to optimize MPPT performance in less-ideal conditions, and minimizing voltage differential to optimize DC-DC conversion efficiency. Is this correct?


The recommendations only deal with 36 and 72 cell panels, I would like to understand the math/logic behind these recommendations so I can understand how it applies to 60 cell panels and 96 cell panels, etc.

For instance for a 24v battery, Victron recommends 144 cells in series. Would 120 cells or 96 cells be less ideal?

Dzl asked
Dzl answered ·

1 Answer

Quattro 48/1000: combining 1 battery bank to 4 quattro's: 3Phase + 1 Single phase

Dear all

Can I expand an existing 3phase Quattro system with 3 quattros 48/10000 and 1 battery bank with an extra single quattro 48/10000 for an extra single phase load connected to the same battery bank.

Thanks for the feedback

Jo

FandM asked
Jwfrary answered ·

2 Answers

How to wire start assist with Orion DC-DC, AGM stater battery, Lithium House battery.

VE-direct-drawing-with-Phoenix-charger-12-50-1-inverter-375W-Li-Batt-mini-BMS-MPPT-100-30-Orion-Tr-smart.pdf

I want to implement something along the lines of attached wiring diagram.

I need to be able to crank off house battery in emergency. How would I implement that?

craigp asked
JohnC answered ·

1 Answer

Peak shaving

Hello,

I have 30 kWp solar system with 3xvictron multiplus and 30 kWh battery. The setup is as follows:

  • grid offset is set to 50 (50 W are all the time taken from network)
  • all produced energy ist consumed in the object
  • the energy which is not consumed is saved in battery
  • when there is greater demand on consumption than the current PV productiion than is the electricty drawn from battery until the battery reach the minimum limit
  • when there is no solar and no capacity in battery, than all the electricity comes from network
  • ...

so classic setup.

I would like to use the system to watch the reserved capacity as follows:

  • on the regular operation as described above I would like to use max 50% of the battery capacity.
  • when there is enought power from PV and more then 50% of the battery than the system shoul have 50 W offset
  • when there is not enought power from PV and less then 50% of the battery than the system should use only the energy from PV and from grid until it approach the Reserved capacity limit (let’s say 5 k W)
  • When the consumption is for example 10 kW and the sun produce 3 kW than the system should be able to mantain 5 kW from network, 3 kW from PV and draw aditional 2 kW from the battery (also when the charge level is less than 50%). When the consumption drops to 2 kW than the battery should be charged from network or PV, but we need to keep the reserved capacity at maximum 5 kW (so when ther is no PV than the battery should be charged from network at rate of 3 kW - reserved capacity 5 kW should be not exceeded).

Is my point to you clear?

Is this possible?


Jan Zmrhala asked
Alexandra commented ·

3 Answers

Constant voltage

I have a motorhome with an onboard control board that includes charging logic from a mains charger and or solar supply. The current panel control is terribly inefficient and I want to put a 75/10 in there to allow significant charge on dull days, by increasing board voltage/capacity although max current is 10 amps-. Current system charges at 2 amps on the brightest possible day but I can not add a new panel as the vontroller is very limited.

Anyway ideally I want to provide a constant voltage to the board from the Victron, say 13.8 volts give or take, so the existing board could then do its charge thing-split charge batteries and control output to them etc.

Can the Victron 75/10 be set to do this. Ideally there would only be the one pair of connections to the board. Although I could connect load to board and battery output to the battery I would rather not as I wonder wether when I plug into mains and the onboard battery charger is powered it would cause problems.....It also needs to be considered that there is another charge system, the alternater, during drive times, this charges vehicle battery, and leisure battery once voltage is over about 13v.

Wingphil asked

0 Answers

How do I open the RVSC file to check battery settings with my config?

I have a Quattro 48/10000/140-2x100, a SmartSolar Charger MPPT 150/100 rev2 . with 2 x 3.5kw Kilowatt Sirius Capacitor Module.

I want to download the configurations and confirm that they are correct.

The download is a RVSC file which I cannot open with the VE connect app or software on my PC.

How do I get the configs into a format that I can share them with Kilowatt to confirm the setting are optimal?



spikedlr asked
Guy Stewart (Victron Community Manager) answered ·

1 Answer

two sma on grid pv inverters ac coupled on ac1 on quattro for off grid system

I have one SMA SB5.0 and one SMA SB1.1 which I like to use for an off grid system in ac coupling configuration. Both will be in parallel on AC1. I'll use a quattro 24/8000 as the I/C. As the 1:1 rule is met are there any other consideration to observe?

karlheinzhaller asked
Anthony answered ·

1 Answer

How to synchronise or to do a proper charge with a Blue Smart charger and Smart Solar MPPT without a GX system

Hello everybody,

This is a classic topic for tiny ESS Systems (for a small campervan).

Here is the configuration

1 x BMV 712 Smart
1 x Smart Battery Sense
1 x SmartSolar MPPT
1 x Battery 100Ah 12V (Max charge current 25A)
1 x Solar Panel 115W 12V
1 x Battery Protect 12/24V (not Smart)
1 x BlueSmart Charger 12V
(Optionally 1 x Phoenix Charger (not Smart))

I'd like to know if there is a built-in function to synchronise the charge between those two chargers (BlueSmart Charger + SmartSolar MPPT). If not, i hope that this will be implemented in the next years.

Note : I don't want to buy a GX system such as Venus GX or ColorControl GX for available space reason and also the price.

I found many subjects on the strategy to "associate" the charge of those two components :

  1. How intelligent are the SMART systems and can they communicate with each other?
  2. Simple Campervan with solar & Bluesmart mains charger
  3. Help please, questions about conflicts between mppt, ac dc charger and alternator engine...
  4. Can I combine a Blue Smart Charger and a MPPT BlueSolar charge controller
  5. MPPT 75/10 75/15 and BatteryLife and external chargers
  6. How to setup multiple chargers connecting simultaneously.

There are pieces of answers on those subjects but it remains not clear to me.

Should i understand that at the moment this is technicaly possible to connect two different chargers but this is not optimised ?

I also see that VE is working on making the Blue Smart Charger compatible with VE.Smart Networking (Here).

In the end my question is this : How to synchronise or to do a proper charge with a Blue Smart charger and Smart Solar MPPT without a GX system and is there strong VE ressources on this subject ?

Looking forward to reading you.

Vince

VinceN asked
Justin Cook - Bay Marine Supply USA answered ·

2 Answers

Smart solar 150/100 with Tristar Diversion controller settings

Hello all

I plan to use a Morningstart Tristar pwm diversion controller in solar system with a Victron 150/ 100 MPPT to divert excess energy to a DC immersion heater . I am struggling to understand the settings esp on the morning star. The manual and vids for Tristar suggest that it should be set to absorb above the absorb level of the Victron ( in my case with Victron AGM's this would 14.4 V for Victron and 14.6v for Tristar my question is if Victron holds voltage at 14.4 and decreases current as it does in absorb. Am I right in thinking the voltages will never reach the Tristar diversion threshold so will never divert anything . And it If I set tristar at 14.4 v will there be anything to divert as Victron will be trying to drop the current in absorb ? Does anyone have any experience of this set up and ant advice on level to set Tristar at ?

regards Simon

Simon Phillips asked
Espen commented ·

2 Answers

Solar cables size to MPPT . Combiner ?

9 x 270 w solar panels in 3S 3p

Max 42v - 9a

MPPT 150/100


I generally use 10awg (2,5mm) solar panel cables . This system has 9 panels in 3 series of 3.

If i wire and use Y MC4 (without a combiner box), I could have only 1 pair of solar panels cables from the roof to the MPPT which is 90 feet away.

This pair will roughly support 120 v and 27a at max. I am a bit worried with the size of the cables .

Would you think 10awg is large enough for this ? Or would you consider preferably:

1/ a combiner box close to the roof and then a larger cable to the MPPT ? May be 6 mm.

2/ or leave 3 pairs so each will be 120v/9a which is more acceptable for this size of cable ?

Thanks for your input.


Herve RV Nizard asked
Simon Phillips answered ·

3 Answers

is it Ok to use 63Ah/ 360V Noark Non Polarised Circuit Breakers instead of Fuses?

G,day Everyone,

I'm in the process of upgrading my solar charging system in from a Epever Tracer to a Victron Smart Solar MPPT 100/50 controller and a Evpower BCU-NEV.

My system is 12V with no inverter or external charging option other than solar, I have 4 x 130Ah Winston LYP Cells 3.3V each and three 12V 150W solar panels, the largest power draw would be 15Ah at any one time.

Previously I had this system for 3 years with the Epever tracer just using Blade fuses to protect the system.

My Question is it Ok to use 63Ah/ 360V Noark Non Polarised Circuit Breakers instead of Fuses?

In the attached Diagram I have sketched out my wiring configuration and I would like peoples opinions on what I need to change to improve safety?

Cheers

Finn

[image]

Finn asked
NigelFXS answered ·

2 Answers

Limit injection to a maximum value allowed in ESS System with AC and DC coupling

I have an ESS installation with 15kWp in AC-Coupling with Fronius and 5kWp in MPPT in DC.


The problem I have is that the grid capacity is 10 kW and I cannot inject more of that power because the thermomagnetic circuit trips.


In ESS mode when I choose the option " optimized with Battery Life". and I select Fronius zero feed-in and also I put a negative grid reference value (-10kW) the system works perfectly and the injection curve is practically flat when the charges are low and the batteries are charged, but the problem is when the loads power increases and the Production is lower, the system itake energy from the batteries to inject and thus maintain that flat curve or that injection reference value to the grid.


The question is, how can I limit the energy feed-in to the grid to a maximum of 10 kW without having to set the settings described in the previous paragraph?


There is a configuration, a device such as energy meters or something like that to limit injection as the maximum allowed value and not as a constant injection value.




Thank you very much in advance for the reply.

Andres asked
ejrossouw answered ·

1 Answer

Smart Shunt VE.Direct to MPPT 150/85 VE.CAN

I have a MPPT 150/85 VE.CAN on the way. I purchased the VE.CAN option to eventually integrate with my N2K network.

I am looking for a battery monitoring system. A bit overwhelmed by all the VE options. I am leaning towards the smart shunt, but honestly dont have a good grasp on pros/cons on all the options (BMW-712, lynx, etc). My requirements would be well met short term using the connect app, but long term i want to have the data on the N2K network. Can the smart shunt integrate into the MPPT via VE.direct or bluetooth connection? If so can the MPPT relay data to the N2K network? It appears that a GX product can do this, but would rather not add another expensive part to the system...

ericrrmorin asked

0 Answers

Frustrated, all I want to figure out is...How to charge two different types of batteries in the one system

...Is there a Victron setup that will allow me that control charging of my two 12V 100Ah Relion LiFePO4 house batteries and a 12V gel starting battery with a 12V charger/inverter, while also handling solar panel and wind generator charging.
Every attempt to determine how to do this (if possible) from the website info has ended up with me completely confused. I've talked to two dealers by email (from when I would buy the necessary equipment), and both have quit responding after the second email from me asking how their suggested equipment would handle one aspect or another of my setup. I guess they didn't know the answer (and I know the overall Victron system options are very large and confusing) and figured finding out the answers wasn't worth the profit.
Can anyone provide some guidance on whether my system wishes are even possible? It seems straightforward, but I guess it isn't.

Oceanwolfe asked
Oceanwolfe commented ·

1 Answer

Parrallel Multiplus/Grid security switch linked to master cutoff switch in Home distribution unit

Hello,


I've been scowering documentation and community's about this but could not find a scenario that fit's mine.

I'm planning on running a Multiplus or Multigrid unit in parallel with the mains, to function primarily as UPS for 1 specific load group, utilizing surplus DC from the solar inverter and AC from the mains to keep the battery's charged.

In The Netherlands, it is obligatory to have your Home distribution unit wired in such a way that the whole power system can be turned of in 1 action with 1 hand. usually, this is done by placing a master cutoff switch in the lower right corner, marked red, that turns of all power in the building in case of work, fire, or other emergencies.

I can use an auxiliary contact or magnetic contact linked to the Main cutout switch to trip the ESS Safety security switch assistant so that it shuts down the AC part of the unit.

Is this also possible using the Remote ON/OFF input on the unit itself? I rather not rely on software-based triggers in case of emergency if at all possible of course.

How have other people solved this issue? I know it is kind of contradicting wanting to run it as a UPS to make sure you have power in case of an outage, but at the same time being able to completely cut off power to all loads and disabling the Victron Multi...

Any thoughts or links to reference materials in this?

svanderlaars asked

0 Answers

Using two different phases for AC-1-in and AC-2-in

I have the following setup:

1 Quattro 48 | 10000 | 140 – 100|100 – 230V

2 MPPT 250 | 100’s

CCGX running ESS

Solar panels and Lithium Batteries

My house has 3-phase power supply but the Victron system (installed on the one phase) is used to power almost all of the regularly used loads. So the other two phases are not frequently used much to power loads.

Our municipal power is unstable in the sense that the voltage fluctuates a lot, continuously cycling between ~200V and up to ~270V very regularly (often more than 10 times a day and could stay high, beyond 255V for an hour). I have found that mostly, when the phase I use on the Victron, has a high voltage, the other phases are within normal range (say 220-245V).

So I use the Victron to shut out the municipal power when it reaches 250V in order to protect my equipment. But then, it then also shuts off AC-2-out and my pool pump and cellar aircon amongst other non-essential loads shut down for the duration that the municipal power voltage is high, until it returns to 245V upon which the Victron takes in municipal power again.

I would like these loads on AC-2-out to run more regularly (when they are supposed to run) and not keep switching on and off all the time through the day. So, I am thinking of connecting one of the other phases (from the 3-phase supply) to the AC-2-in. This is in the hope that the Quattro will immediately transfer to AC-2-in when AC-1-in reaches the “too high” voltage and gets shut out. So all the loads can continue running undisturbed while AC-1-in is high and once it comes into normal range (currently set at 245V, but I will probably revise it downwards) the Quattro will switch back to AC-1-in.

Is this how the Quattro will deal with such a setup? I.e. will it switch immediately to AC-2-in, or will it not do so as there is still voltage (albeit too high) on the terminals of AC-1-in? Or is there a significant time delay before after having switched out AC-1-in, before switching over to AC-2-in?

Is there a better alternative to consider, given my objective?

Thanks in advance,

Theo

Theo Pretorius asked
Theo Pretorius answered ·

6 Answers

Settings lifepo4 campervan setup

hello everyone, I would need your advice.
it's about the expansion of a camper and have the following setup:

- Multiplus C 12v 1600

- Bucket Boost 50A

- MPPT 100/30

- Liontron 200Ah.

In order to save the battery, I would like to create 3 different charging curves
Maximum: 100% for bad weather / high power requirements

Normal: 10-90% battery condition for normal days / sunny weather.

Storage mode: ~ 50%

is there a possibility to change all 3 devices in parallel? With Solar, you can still use the app. Another idea would be to set the shore power / charge converter to 80-90% and only control the rest via the change in the MPPT.

And is there a way to deactivate the bucket boost manually using the toggle switch? if the vehicle is only used for driving and should not be charged.


would you connect the solar cells in series or in parallel?

Scheflo asked

0 Answers

Smart Shunt use cases.

Hi,

I have two questions. I’ve been waiting for a stand-alone shunt ever since I bought the BMV712. So this is fantastic. My questions are,

I’d like to use the 1000 or 2000 amp unit on my vehicles starter battery to monitor it’s state of charge & to make sure my accessories & auxiliary battery system aren’t using all of my alternators available current & starving the starter battery of charge. Would this be ok with instant cranking & heavy winching demands?

Second, I’m currently exploring the rest of the Victron product range, including solar chargers. My DC-DC charger is a 3rd party, but I would love to be able to monitor it via the GX devices, or event just the Connect App. Could this shunt be used in a dumb down state, less of a battery monitor, more of a simple voltage & current monitor for the input side of a DC-DC charger. The BMV712 is already on the battery side. The hope here is to allow the GX to visibly show where the curr ent is being supplied from, just as it would if it was a networked Victron DC-DC. I understand this would be less desirable to Victron as the goal would be to sell your DC-DC chargers, however there are applications where current & voltage may want to be monitored as part of a larger system not yet catered for, such as monitoring discrete loads as opposed to just current draw on the battery. Being able to label that in the app & monitor it via VRM could be a great use of this.

rickicook asked
Gerrit answered ·

1 Answer

Looking for professional system designer to help with EV Refit of a 48' Motor Yacht

[image]

Looking to hire/collaborate with a system designer who has previous experience designing a system for a motor yacht or sailboat. It can be globally based. We can collaborate over the internet using draw.io. I've created a rough diagram of my idea.


Please find my diagram here: https://drive.google.com/open?id=1_cgSoFykH7BRqq-ECAIdWs_vHTshDzvJ


I've posted the job here on UpWork where you can define your hourly rate for this job and get started right away securely:


https://www.upwork.com/jobs/~01247ccfe86909cddb


Looking forward tow working with you :)



dsdon asked
dsdon answered ·

1 Answer

System Alarm Grid Lost

For a few days now we've been getting a system alarm that says "Grid Lost." I can highlight it on our CCGX screen, but it doesn't go away. (I.E. The warning triangle in the top of the screen keeps flashing no matter what I do.) It also does not register on the VRM site under Alarm Logs...

We have not lost grid power once in this time period.

I do however use the CCGX's relay and it's automatic Generator on/off rules to tell the Quattro when to pull power from the grid. (I do this so we can use the energy stored in our batteries first.) So while the Shorepower meter shows zero, we are still connected to the grid.

We also have a PV inverter connected to our Quattro's 230v output, which gave me a grid error once, but I've not seen that happen again. (Meaning it might have but then went away before I noticed it...)

Did something change in the firmware to cause us to get this alarm?

We were running 2.51 but it also happened when I updated it to 2.52.

Thanks to anyone that can help!

Scott


ScottNelson asked
Harold answered ·

3 Answers

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