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Lithium Battery

Alternator charging solution for non-Victron lithium batteries

Installing a full Victron system, Multiplus, Cerbo ,Touch 50 etc

But my batteries are CALB, and an EMUS BMS, with an Isabellenhuette shunt (supposedly fully Victron compatible)

As well as the Multiplus I'll be charging with an 120A engine alternator.

I'm keen not to cook either the alternator or the batteries.

I believe the Victron Smart BMS CL12/100 and the BMS 12/200 are for Victron batteries only?

Therefore other options I'm considering are:

  1. Wakespeed WS500 alternator regulator to charge lithiums
  2. Sterling 120A battery to battery charger between engine start and lithiums
  3. 4 x Victron Orion-TR Smart 12/12 30 DC/DC chargers in parallel

Really confused over the best way forward.

Any advice gratefully received.



jokani asked
msmolow answered ·

2 Answers

Best configuration for Narada 48NPFC100 in Multiplus II

Hello, I need help to configure a Multiplus II 3000 with 2 Narada 48NPFC100 lithium batteries in a PV system with 2 SMA Sunny Boy 1.5 in an off-grid system. The system is working fine and charging the batteries until for some reason unknown to me, the Multiplus raise the frequency and shuts down the SMA inverters (also the electricity in the house) even when the batteries are not fully charged. My supplier in Chile for both Narada Batteries and Victron Multiplus doesn´t answer my queries and I don´t trust in the batteries and charger configuration (VEConfigure and ESS) that the supplier gave me earlier. If more info is needed please ask me for it. Any help will be very appreciated.

Info from last 3 days:

[image]

VEConfigure:

[image]

ESS:

[image]


PS: may be @NicoV or @Daniël Boekel (Victron Energy Staff) can help me? Thanks!!!

santiago-mackay asked
santiago-mackay commented ·

1 Answer

More than 5 lithium batteries with BMS

I currently have 4 100ah smart lithium batteries on my boat with the BMS connected to a multiplus 3000. I would like to add more batteries but apparently the BMS will only handle a maximum of 5 batteries. Is there any way of having 6 batteries either on one BMS, or could I have 2 domestic battery banks each with its own BMS linked together as a 12v system? Thank you

rayf asked
tozz commented ·

2 Answers

Is it possible to configure a Multiplus compact 1600 for LiPo batteries?

I have read the manual and as far as I can tell there is no mention of Lithium batteries or how to configure the Multiplus for them. I no longer have any batteries apart from a 24v 200amp hour LiPo so i need to find out if the Multiplus is still okay to use. I have a Blue Solar 100/15 Charge controller.

Jonathan Phillips asked
seb71 commented ·

2 Answers

IP67 not charging LFP completely
Hi All...

I just connected a brand new Victron IP67 12/17 charger to my LFP bank (down in my basement for now) and set it up for LFP. I let it rip! It was off to a great start, then stopped very early. Turns out when the app says it's outputting 14V, the DMM and BMS disagree and say its a good 0.35 volt lower. The graphs in the app think it hit 14.2 and switched into "storage."


This is about the most simple LFP battery charger ever. There don't appear to be any calibrations or the like, and I just used the built in LFP profile, which looks to be pretty good.


Any ideas?

heatwave asked

0 Answers

overcharging and victron orion DC-DC Tr smart 24/24-17 (400) in parallel 2 units

Trying to understand/figure out how to avoid overcharging of LiFePo4 batteries. If the charging profile is left at the default profile, and the vehicle is occasionally stopped and started on a undetermined schedule, so that the charging profile begins over again every time, how does the smart charger prevent overcharging? As I recall every time the charger loses the input voltage, the charging algorithm begins again with bulk charging. Could this lead to overcharging the lithium batteries (also in parallel)?

oldorange asked

0 Answers

Orion-Tr Smart, VE.Direct and integration with GX devices?

Hey there, as I commented on the blog post,

"I'm curious if future versions will have VE.Direct or some sort of integration like that with GX devices? Currently, it seems that the MPPT and MultiPlus are able to coordinate their total charge rate with external BMS via the GX devices. But it seems that the Orion-Tr does not participate in this?"

I'm wondering if there's a way to integrate the Orion-Tr Smart chargers with the CCGX. In particular, as far as I understand, GX devices can coordinate with external BMS via CANBus to determine the charging parameters of a battery. It seems that the Victron MPPT and Victron MultiPlus can respect these limits via VE.Direct and VE.Bus respectively, which is great and a big reason why I bought this BMS and the suite of Victron product.

Now I'm considering purchasing Orion-Tr Smart chargers, however I noticed that they don't have any VE.Direct connectivity, or any other VE connectivity aside from the Bluetooth one. Is something like VE.Direct, VE.Bus or VE.Can planned? Will Orion-Tr Smart chargers integrate with GX devices?

aybabtme asked
Pantelis Zirinis answered ·

9 Answers

charging lead starter battery on/in a lithium system solar

hi this is my first post

im spelling is not the best but please bear with me .

so i have put together a diagram of the system

i was using a cyrix-ct relay to top up the van(starter) battery from the house bank which in turn was being charged from the mppt ,this was a great easy system.

so now iv moved to lithium battery bank (house) with ve bms setup im not shore where to best place to link the lead starter battery too ?

[image]

i take any advice offed thank you

WOULD LIKE TO NOTE

CHANGED TO PIC. AS SCHOOL BOY ERASERS MADE ON FIRST DRAWING THANKS FOR BRING TO MY NOTENESS

treecircles asked
treecircles edited ·

2 Answers

can i configure my old dual Pheonix Multiplus 24/3000/70 inverter charger to charge Lithium Battery

Hi Newbie to this and forums in general.

I have an old generation Phoenix Multiplus 24/3000/70 dual or daisy chained charger inverter system on our boat. We have used it with 10x250AH lead acid batteries configured for 24VDC. I want to change these for lithium and want to know if i can get the inverter charger programmed to charge the lithium batteries. I am also looking at purchasing an electrodacus SMS0 in support of it if that helps in answering the question?

BR

Guy


guy-odell asked
guy-odell commented ·

0 Answers

Blue Smart Charger stuck on Bulk Charge for hours

I'm charging my Battleborn LifePO4 using the Lithium-ion preset and it's been stuck on Bulk Charge @ 13.7V for hours now. Is this normal?

manny-martinez asked
Stefanie commented ·

2 Answers

Lithium battery bank (VE Modules) and Multiplus II

I know this question is bordering not relevant for Victron, but I may not be alone with this issue - and there are so many skilled techies here so I hope you can forgive me.

I just purchased 5x VE modules Samsung SDI 2,08Kwh, modules are configured in 12S cells 42Ah, so the voltage range is between 38,4v-49,2v.

I want to build a bank around 10kWh capacity, so the config 12S5P.

I have a Multiplus II 48/3000 wich I want to use, so the question is the voltage range suitable for the charger section of the Multiplus?

Attached an image of one module

[image]

Thanks in advance




xotet asked
xotet answered ·

2 Answers

Lifepo4 capacity and lynx shunt calibration

Hello from sunny south florida,

I an Electrician and my company assigned me that task of building out a camper van for a client. After some research I ended up using a multiplus 12/3000 with a CCGX, the lynx shunt 1000a, a 45amp mppt solar charger with ~250w worth of solar panels on top of the van(I wanted more panels but customer wanted more storage)and 2 renogy 170Ah lifepo4 batteries in parallel, and an alternator charger. The equipment seems to be operating as it should with the exception 1 thing that just popped up last night. The load on the system is roughly 20w to power the ccgx and the cellular internet (according to my CCGX).

20200522_144703.jpg

[image]

with the rating of the batteries at 2175w each i estimated the system should run for ~200hrs +/-with no charge, ive been monitor the vehicle through VRM and it all has checked out until yesterday..the customer has had the van parked not in use all of last week. We had good weather all week with the exception of friday when it was cloudy all day and the solar didnt produce much.

To get to the point though the batteries died after ~ only 24-32hrs of no input am i mis-calculating something here or do i need to look into the current calibration of the system?


dan3i asked
build20 answered ·

2 Answers

Alternator and regulator for Victron Lifepo4 smart battery.

Hi, i like to instal second alternator in mercedes sprinter , i have a 400Ah ( 600 in the future )battery bank and i like to charge it fast. I found alternator and i need your opinion is it right one for my battery ?

https://www.nationsstarteralternator.com/N62-Mercedes-Sprinter-280XP-High-Amp-Alternator-p/sprinter-280xp-3.0-n62-er-l.htm

Thank you for your help

siemcio asked

0 Answers

How can I set custom SOC in my Multiplus C 12/1600/70 without using VE config?

I have lithium batteries in my boat and do not want to charge them to more than 85% SOC normally except when I plan longer trips and want to top them off to 100%. Is it someway I can change that through either VRM or via Cerbo and Touch 50 without using VE Config? Would be a nice feature to have for managing lithium banks. Custom SOC and then shut off the charger when SOC is reached. Second feature would be to have the auxiliary charger on for maintaining current to the AGM starter battery bank.

trulsla asked
Alexandra edited ·

1 Answer

Is it ok to add a second LiFePo4 battery later?

Hi! I was told that I shouldn't add a second battery later on, that they need to be together from the beginning. I wanted to start with a "Victron Energy LiFePO4 Battery 12,8V / 200Ah Smart" and add a new one later if needed. Would that be possible?

georgeleonardo asked
marekp edited ·

4 Answers

LifePO4 Battery 3x200 or 2x300

Customer asked if it was better to use 3x 200Ah LifePO4or 2x 300Ah LifePO4, I can answer financially but not sure how to answer what is best for the system.

lee-toole asked
seb71 commented ·

1 Answer

Semi Off Grid dilemma

Hi All

Skylla with Quattro setup

I am from South Africa, so some of you will know that except for the constant looming of loadshedding , our electrical grid is in a bad state.
When ever one wants to install a Grid Connected solar system, does not matter what brand or type, Grid Tied or Hybrid, when you connect the input of your inverter to ESKOM( our power utility) in the country side you need to hand in an application first with all plans and designs prior to installation. Even if you do not plan on feeding back to the grid. They are very strict regarding this. Which is understandable, but very frustrating and tedious and can take very long.

When connecting to municipality in a town they are somehow and somewhat less strict.


This leads me to my question, and please direct me to the relevant thread if this has been covered somewhere else. Also do not hesitate to shut my train of thought down if it is not possible or not legal. I am merely pondering with ideas around a problem lots of customers and installers face

Is it at all possible to have the following system :—Grid point transformer is a 50kVa point—

So any loads on the system cannot ex

3 X Quattro 15 KVA 3 phase setup (no AC input)

6 x 250/100 MPPT

40 kw PV array for MPPTs

Fimer or Fronius 50 kVa string inverter on AC output of Quattros

50kW array for string inverter

100

kWh lithium battery bank

3 x Skylla TG 48V in paralell to charge battery bank (specified hours at night or cloudy days)

Cerbo GX

All relevant fusing and isolation and earthing of course.

The important part is an 3 phase automatic on load change over switch.

Once the battery reaches a certain SOC a relay can be triggered to energise a contactor to automatically switch the load back to grid.

Center changeover

It is important that the hybrid and pv inverters are not connected to the grid what so ever.

The only grid connection is the Skylla chargers that feed the batteries if needed.

This way you are not completely off grid witch is fine because the main goal is minimal reliance on the grid without the time consuming and difficult long process.

Perhaps someone gan assist me or advise me if this train of thought is completely off the rails.

Thank you

bergmans-trading-cc asked
Alexandra commented ·

0 Answers

Connect ve.bus BMS to Venus GX

I have a Lithium system with ve.bus BMS and want to know the cell voltages. I don't have the Smart variety batteries. I also want the other benefits of having the BMS talk with the Venus.

According to the CCGX manual, one can connect the BMS directly to the CCGX and I would assume by extension, to the Venus. I quote from the manual with regards to the be.bus BMS:

"Connect the CCGX to the socket labelled ‘MultiPlus/Quattro’, or to one of the Multis/Quattros in the system. Do not connect it to the Remote panel socket on the VE.Bus BMS."

I have not been able to get the BMS to show up as a device on the Venus, but all my other devices do. I have contacted my dealer who assured me I should be plugging the Venus into the "remote panel" socket on the BMS even when I quoted him the manual. This did not do anything, either.

Someone else on here asked a similar question and was told they could not be connected. Given that the bus is merely passing on data, I don't see why it should not work, but with all the contradicting information I don't know what to do.

Any advice would be appreciated.

Christie

christie asked
mvader (Victron Energy) commented ·

1 Answer

Simple 'mobile' lithium system planning

Hi everyone. I have just had the oppertunity to purchase two of the older style (not smart) LifePo4 200ah batteries with very low use and have decided this is the time to up my mobile / solar power game. I do not have a boat, a van or anything like that. This is just a project for the boot of my car, as well as the garden.

I plan to build all of this into a wheeled peli case or similar. Please see my sketch. I think its OK, but I have a couple of questions:

[image]

1. Do I need a SmartShunt? Since I am using the VE Bus BMS, will the VE Bus Smart Dongle connect straight to it and give me similar information? Mainly looking for capacity measurements.

2. If I do need a SmartShunt, have I got the placement correct? Between battery bank and main negative bus?

3. Is there an easier way to put this together? Different products?


Thanks

Tom

tom-stephens asked

0 Answers

Superpack in series?

Why cannot Superpack batteries be connected in series?

What happens if they are connected in series?

Thanks

cloverandstraw asked
Alexandra commented ·

1 Answer

Expand Victron Smart 12.8/200Ah LiFeP04 House Bank

Our flooded lead acid house bank is at end-of-life. I would like to start a new 12V bank with 1 or 2 new Victron Smart 12.8/200Ah model BAT512120610, then expand it up to 6 over the course of six months to a year (for a total of 1200Ah) if this is possible.

At the time of capacity expansion, if:
1) all existing batteries are wired in the Posts style (see diagram below); AND
2) the existing bank is fully charged; AND
3) the new battery is also fully charged (via separate IP65); AND
4) voltage is identical on the existing bank and the new battery prior to connection,

is there any reason why this plan would not work?


I understand that the ideal is to have ALL the batteries exactly the same age and SOC from the very beginning, but this isn't always the case.

[image]

sv-drumbeat asked
sv-drumbeat edited ·

0 Answers

Adaptive Charge curve and absorbtion time for Litium Batterys

Hei

I am using a Multi plus 24/3000/70-50 for 24 Volt/300 Ah Lithium Battery bank (Drop in Batterys,LITHIUM IRON PHOSPHATE)

I am uncertain about my charger configuration, especially Adabitve Charge curve and absorbtion time .

Charge current 52 A

Absorbtion Voltage 28,4 V (given by Battery producer)

Floate Voltage 27 Volt (given by Battery producer)

Repeated absorbtion time 1 Hour

Max Absorbtion time 1 Hour

Charge curve: Adaptive

Battery Safe: ON.

Lithium batterys: ON

.Are this OK ?

Is a Adabitve Charge curve suitable for Litium Batterys.

[image]

robert-larsson asked
Alexandra edited ·

1 Answer

Why can't a 12,8 V 20ah Lithium SuperPack battery be mounted on the side

The datasheet tells you to only use the battery in upright position. Other manufacturers versions of the same formfactor and capacity can be mounted sideways. What will happen? Degraded performance? Danger of overheating or explosion? Will it leek?

I plan to use these for powering fishfinders and lighting in kayaks, so upright is not always ideal.

twc asked
Justin Cook - Bay Marine Supply USA answered ·

1 Answer

Victron Lithium Smart Battery - Spacing in Battery Box

Hi All

I am in the process of installing 4x 200Ah Smart Lithium (in parallel). I don't have much space in the battery box - in fact it is very tight indeed. Ideally the batteries would be against each other with no space.

I have read in the lithium manual - about the recommended spacing between each battery. I have also aware the batteries will generate heat when being discharged or charged. It is my understanding the amount of heat produced is linked to the level fi charge / discharge.

My total capacity is 800Ah - and the maximum load will only ever be 125A (about 31A per battery)- for very short periods (3 or minutes) - and the maximum charge current will only ever peak at 70A (about 17A per battery). These seem, to me, to be very very low loads / charge currents for each battery to cope with compared to what they are capable of. And, as a result, the batteries will not heat up - and spacing in the box will not be a big issue.

Nearly every installation I see of Lithium, on boats, the batteries are all against each other. I have never seen anyone space them by the recommended space in the manual. I even see this on installations by Victron approved suppliers. It may be that every install I have seen is 'bad' - but no one seems to have any problems.

What do you think ? Must I space them - given the low discharge / charge currents ?

Thanks

Tim


miya asked
miya answered ·

2 Answers

How should I configure an Orion Tr Smart 12|12|30A for lithium batteries?

Should I modified the settings in a Orion Tr Smart if I use lithium batteries?

Which parameters should I use?


Thanks

carloa asked
Stefanie commented ·

2 Answers

Stop charging lifepo4 when battery is full

Hi, I am new to the lifepo4 market but has read a lot about it. In almost all articles about charging it states that you should charge your lifepo4 until its full and then stop charging. But the chargers i have found almost always implement the three stages, bulk, absortion and float (allmost all articles say that you should not float a lifepo4 battery). I am planning to by a battery (not victron) with an external bms with hvc and lvc to cut off loads and charges at certain volts, but i would rather have the charger to sense the voltage and can be programmed to stop charge at a selected level, and use the hvc more like an emergency brake. Is this possible with any not-so-expensive victron charger? Will i encounter any problems if i use the hvc to disconnect the battery from a blue smart charger that is plugged in to AC?

johan-granqvist asked
seb71 commented ·

4 Answers

Disabling charging on SmartSolar at negative temperatures

Hi,

I have a Victron Smart Solar MPPT 100/20-48 and I recently replaced my AGM battery bank with a LiFePO4 battery that is rated for charging down to -15°C at 0,2C. I was going to set the Smart Solar to disable charging below -10° to be on the safe side, but it won't accept a value below 0°.

Is this something you're planning to change with a future firmware update?

Another feature request on the same subject, it would be nice if the Smart Solar could charge at full power above a set temperature, and a lower charge rate at lower temperatures.

asbjoern85 asked
asbjoern85 commented ·

3 Answers

Using Orion DC to DC 24 converter for a Lifepo4 upgrade

I own a 1988 Princess 45 powered by twin Volvo TAMD71A, each equipped with the factory 24v 60A alternator. Each alternator has 2 separate sections to charge the starter batteries (125Ah) and the house deep cycle batteries (210Ah).

I am now upgrading the house batteries to a pack of 280Ah Lifepo4 and my intention is to keep the original 30A charger that charges the house bank and link both the charger and the alternators to a Orion DC to DC Converter to adapt the charging profile to the LifePo4. My question is that when running the engines with the batteries fully charged, is the Orion putting strain on the alternators by cutting the circuit? Or do the alternators just divert the power to the starter batteries?


Thank you!

joaofn asked

0 Answers

Settings Tips mppt 75/15 Bluesolar using Lithium 100ah And 200w Solar Blanket

Just purchased 75/15 blue solar mppt and using with battery box which holds 100ah lithium battery (solar king 100ah) just wondering what the best settings are for mppt setup (Bluetooth Dongle) - I have selected Lifepo4 thus far but that’s it, any other useful tips I’m using 200watt solar blanket - using for camping to run 75l fridge lights etc . Cheers Glen

Glen Rowe asked
peterb381 commented ·

1 Answer

Winter storage batteries -40C

Hi everyone!

About to install an Easysolar II gx system in my mountain cottage in Norway (-37 C this winter). My first off grid move and the fact of there being Victron is amazing. Thx!!

To make it as clear as possible: my question is NOT about charge or discharge but solely about idle storage aka long term effects of freezing electrolytes (freeze point being -30/35 C)

Neither interested in battery heating nor LTO solutions

Most LFP manufacturers define cold storage limit as: -20C

Only Victron and Mastervolt (which both use Winston cells (LYP) spec the batteries to -45C

Failed finding any real test data except one very interesting study that shows that deep freeze ( cryogenic freezing ) got no harmful effect.

This study does not address temperature-fluctuations around freeze point, and only measures short term effects. http://wrap.warwick.ac.uk/119502/13...erflash-cryogenic-freezing-Grandjean-2019.pdf.

It does match my understanding though that the electrolytes do NOT expand when it freezes (unlike water). If so any LFP battery would actually survive sub -30C temperatures ! ?

....this is a technical fringe question and I could just go with the winston/victron/lyp solution but if someone got the science/information I would really appreciate!


the best to you all, Nilo






nilo asked
nilo commented ·

2 Answers

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