Have a possible system to install
Client had a single phase AC grid supply
Is currently having to use a 3 phase generator for his 3 phase equipment means
Wanting to install a 3 phase Quattro set up With 3 phase fronuis SYMO to make make a micro grid
I know we can use the 3 phase generator for supplement the charging that the solar is falling short of
my question is can the single phase grid supply usable for supplementary charging with the 3 phase Quattro setup
Answering the question my self I would say no
Tho I think it may be usable if a single to 3 phase converter is used ???
anyone have any thoughts on this ?
We use a grid parallel 3-ph system with 3 Quattro-48 10000-140-100/100 inverters and 4 Smart 25.6V-200Ah batteries. The ESS description states that in the External control mode, it is possible to forcibly set the system to the power supply mode (discharging to the grid) or charging from the grid using external control. Where can I find information on how to implement this mode, what additional equipment or devices are needed for this? We would like to implement a mode in which, at a certain time, the system power output to the grid (for example, in the amount of 20 kW for 1 hour). Is it possible to configure the system for uneven output in phases, that is, 7 kW is output to the L1 phase, 2 kW is output to the L2 phase, and 1 kW is output to the L3 phase. Is it possible, when issuing one phase, to charging he other phase to discharging mode from the grid? If possible, where can I find detailed information on configuring the system.
I've got 3 x 10 kVA Quattros set up for a 3 phase AC load.
The primary generating source is a 48 V DC Hybrid Generator and lithium battery system connected to the Quattros at 48V DC.
There is a intermittent AC mains resource that I'd like to utilise to charge to batteries or feed the load when available, the AC connection is in single phase. At the moment, the AC-in connection is wired up at 3 phase with 1 phase connected to each of the Quattro AC-in-1 connections.
Can I connect a single phase AC-in even though AC out in 3 phase ?
Should it just be connected to 1 phase only ? i.e. 1 quattro AC-in connection or should I parallel the AC-in across 3 Quattros ?
Wondering if I can run AC coupled solar (on Victron output) on a 3 phase system with single phase grid input ?
I know this works with DC coupled, as I can just turn off switched as group and passthrough/ invert single phase supply to DC then back to 3 phase AC , however can not run PV inverter support or ESS when not switched as group ( so not control available via frequency shifting).
So my question is if I run a 4th quattro, can I add that to phase L1 and and use that to facilitate my single phase supply and have that invert AC supply to DC that way.
I have built the system in demo mode and it looks like it will allow it, but will it actually work? Also it is allowing me to run ESS in the config that I have built, will ESS work under this config as the client wants to export excess solar.
any help would be greatly appreciated.
Just did 2 x awesome installs of 3 phase systems with the ET340 meter. Both are displaying strange behaviour on the consol. grid setpoint is maintained but the + and - numbers on grid side worries me.....
for instance, It shows a total load of 1910W on the meter, but on grid side it kinda splits it in 2, seemingly feeding back to grid on 1 phase?? And this only happens when I have available solar.
Is this normal behaviour? or have I done something wrong??
Wiring of unit, is as per instruction except for neutral that is not going to other side of meter? Not sure if that is an issue? I will check that early next week.
On my ET114 installs on sigle phase I dont see any negative numbers on grid side.
Any help will be appreciated.
I have installed a 3 phase system (3x15kVA Quattro) with 8x 250/100 MPPT's.
The system however is not utilising the solar for all 3 phases but only for the red phase which is also the master inverter. I also noticed that the "inverter on" LED is flashing on the master unit while the mains on all 3 units are solid.
Additionally it is keeping the batteries charged at all times although I have the SOC set to 30%. The other 2 phases are pulling the power from the grid.
I have dual Quattro 10kva/120s in split phase. We are 'off grid' and have exactly 20kva solar input available using enphase micro-inverters a/c coupled to AC-OUT1. For the battery storage we have 110KWH of lithium ion batteries. These feed the inverters via a Lynx 1000amp bus system with 4/0 cables going to the inverters. Quattro firmware is 430.
When the sun is shining, I have plenty of power available, no issues whatsoever. We can routinely run 15 to 17000 watts of electrical load and STILL charge the batteries at 100-150 amps DC. No thermal or overload issues at all.
However, once the sun is down, if loads go above 10000 watts for any length of time L2 gets a temperature alarm and shuts down the system. This is most frustrating. Our entire farm is on this system, including AC, water heater, well pump, etc. At time of shutdown the Color control shows 4900 watts draw on L1 and 5010 watts draw on L2.
Our A/C draws about 20 amps (240v) when running, which is right at 100 amps of dc.
Throw in another load, such as charging one of our EVs at 20 amps (240v) and the system will only run for between 10 and 20 minutes before we get the dreaded:
|VE.Bus System||Automatic monitoring||Temperature L2: Alarm||2021-06-16 20:06:37|
appears and the inverters shut down.
We are using a 1000 amp Lynx system with two sets of 4/0 battery cables to the Quattros.
Cables are matched for length and size.
What can be done to increase my available power when running on batteries?
*****System: Off Grid
3 x Victron Quattro 10kva
1 x Fronius 10kW Symo - 1 x 20kW Symo
18 x Pylontech US 3000
2 x Skylla 48v 50ah AC chargers ( Supplement charge for batteries )
84 x 410w JA Solar Mono half cell
System was installed on new build home. We experienced dipping in the lights. The electrician has done a logger test last week and the results are a bit concerning. Lowest dip recorded was 180v ( 10 - 60 milliseconds), and it regularly dips below 10%, 207v.
Highest swell recorded 257v (10 - 60 milliseconds )
Attached logger data and Victron data ( 1 min intervals )
L1 (Victron) - Phase B (Logger Test)
L2 - Phase C
L3 - Phase A
The underfloor heating runs on Phase C (L2). It switched off on Tuesday morning and technicians are coming in to have a look.
My question is, has anybody experienced a similar situation? Is there a way to minimize the shifting?
* Results of second test. First 36hrs main DB incoming 3 phase line from Off grid system. Last 36hrs directly on Victron output and termination boxes. (This was done to check that data corresponds and we have no other electrical problem in-between DB and Inverters.)
Results are still the same.
*The underfloor heating has been fixed. Unrelated issue
* We have done a firmware Quattro's and N-E bond in the termination boxes. ( This was done before new logger test was done)
* Lights are more stable. Flickering only happens when sun is going down, load increases and the shift happens between Fronius not being able to supply sufficient power and the batteries taking over (100% SOC) I will follow up with Fronius to see if there is a fix for this. ( I have upgraded the Fronius to latest software)
* My question is: The fluctuations are very short in duration 20 - 40 milliseconds. On average we remain on 230V. I do understand being fully of grid will make the voltages fluctuate. Is this in normal parameters? Is there a way to minimize it? Will it have a negative long-term effect on household appliances?
Just commissioned a 3 phase system using 3 x 24v/5000 quattro and a 6000 amp shunt and 2800 amps of lithium batteries with built in bms units . When the system is charging only we can see a 2000w dc load on the gx device, all batteries and inverters are connected on the shunt properly. Its like one of the chargers is reading on the shunt as a load. What can i check as the system is working perfectly and all batteries are recieving the total charge from the 3 chargers. Their is no dc system load on this install.
I have a 3 phase DC coupled offgrid installation with 400Ah Battery Bank. one of my inverter is giving 220 V on output with small to no load on this phase where the 2 other give 230.. and it goes on overload everytime
i check the wiring and everything is ok
Thank you for your help
I am using a 3 Phase System with a MppT + Smart Shunt + Color Display .
Problem is: Display shows Discharge on Battery, see Pic1, although the only POSSIBLE way for the currrent to go is to charge the Battery. The LEAD Battery is charging per acid reading.
With the settings of the Battery i know for sure that they might be incorrect - standadized settings.
The smart Shunt is polarized correctly - MINUS to System to GND System with 3 Phase System; Minus to Battery to Minus Pole directly on one Pole.
With this setup I already had a correct Current/Charge Reading once; I did however take too much out of battery (battery acid reading showed enough SOC but Display had a lower percentage saved for safety meassures - so battery was in fact still ok to be used - Display did not activate Grid support as it should have - it now does) and the polarization inverted on its own. It went from low percentage to suddenly 100% with negative currentpolarization.
Another issue I face/question I have is that with disconnected Grid and disconnected Load, the only apparent path for the current to take is to charge the Battery. However as you can see in pic 2 the battery still shows a discharge, the Mppt shows correctly positive 5A and positive voltage ( instead of -1A what Color Display shows). Also there are roughly 600W missing in the System ( PV brought a constant of 700W so there is no fluctuation there either.
To summarize my two issues are: Why does my battery charge but is displayed as discharge when Polarization to Battery should be correct
Why am I missing several Hundreds Watts in Display and why does MPPT show a different Current than Color Grid.
All Loadcomponents from System are hooked up on 3Phase system. Nothing else is hooked up inbetween so I am not sending Watts elsewhere undocumented.
In this wiring diagram, Victron Energy shows how you can integrate other battery manufacturers lithium batteries into a fully integrated Victron system. This system uses three 48 Volt 5000VA Quattro Inverter Chargers in a three-phase system.
The diagram shows how Freedom Won Lithium batteries can be connected to a Victron Energy system. There is plenty of documentation on our website for setting up three-phase systems as well as how Freedom Won LiFePO4 Batteries are configured.
Here is a link to the full-sized pdf.
I noted from another forum answer by @Johannes Boonstra (Victron Energy Staff), that 3 phase asymmetrical systems are an option.
Different numbers of multi's on each phase.
I understand the need for AC and DC cabling symmetry within those confines.
However, when I look at the ESS assistant and the PV assistant the first message that flashes up is that there must be a symmetry of multi and PV inverters.
In an off-grid set-up, if I want an asymmetrical system as far as Multi's go, do I have to forgo the option of AC coupling?
The last couple of days my 3 phase multiplus II 5kva system has been deciding around 11am to disconnect from the grid and run off of battery/solar until around 4pm.
I presume the system is upset about grid voltage or something, but I can't actually spot any place inside the Cerbo GX that may indicate what it considers to be the problem.
As far as I can tell, the grid voltage on all phases is less than the overvoltage 10 minute average value configured in ve.config for each multiplus.
Hello, I have a problem with a three-phase installation consisting of 3x Multiplus 48/5000/70-100. It is an off-grid installation with a Pylontech lithium battery bank and SmartSolar controllers, all controlled with a Cerbo GX through DVCC. The system works smoothly off-grid. But a three-phase electrical network connection was installed in the sector, and with this the house was connected to the network and increased consumption with the intention of using the electrical network.
The idea of the new operating mode is to use the solar system as a priority (and complete backup in case of grid failure), and to leave the grid as support at times when the loads exceed the capacity of the inverters or the batteries are low. For this, the virtual switch was configured in "Ignore dedicated AC input" mode, according to manuals this instruction must be configured only to Master L1 and when doing it in this way the instruction really works but only responds to the values of L1, and when it is exceeded the power (4500W) in L2 or L3 the system does not transfer, generating an overload in inverters and cutting the system. When configuring the virtual switch with the same instruction to ignore AC input in each inverter, the instruction of (no) ignore AC input definitely does not work or operate in any way, the AC input is always ignored and does not transfer at any time.
Is there a way to ignore AC input in 3 phase system and work for all 3 phases, and the system can immediately switch from inverter to main when the loads for any phase exceed the established power limit? (All devices are with updated firmwares.)
is it possible to create a Split Phase System connected to a 3 Phase network?
First Multiplus 2 connected with AC in on Phase 2 and second Multiplus 2 connected with AC in to Phase 2. ESS with Feed Back enabled.
AC Out only of first Multiplus for some loads used.
All Neutrals connected like it is needed in manual.
Technically it should work, but is it considered by Victron Energy Software?
Thanks a lot!
I currently have 3xQuattros operating in 3-phase mode.
Is it possible to add a fourth Quattro, in just inverter mode (utilizing the same battery as the other quattros)?
I would like some form of redundancy in case the 3-phase system has an issue (like overload that switches of all quattros).
This is for equipment that has dual PSUs, like network equipment or servers.
Hi, I´m new to this community and have a question about loading a EV with the cars 3 Phase AC Charger out of the Pylontech Battery. I recently set up a 3 Phase Offgrid System with 3 Quattro 10000. Today I tried to load the EVs battery after sunset with no Solar Power which turned out to work finde. But when i had a look at the GX it stated very different loads on each Phase. I set the Charger to 6A per Phase and had 1200 W at L1, 34w on L2(!) and 2400 W on L3. How can this be altough the charger (go-e Charger) shows 1200 W per Phase? It also seems like the L3 inverter really had the most load because the Fan was on while L2 was quiet? Is there something wrong in my setup or does the car cause this? Thanks for your answers in advance...
I currently have a x15 Quattro48/10000 set up in a 3-phase configuration (5 units each phase). The system is off-grid and boosted by a 175 kW generator each evening for a few hours. Recently one Quattro on Phase 3 has been overloading during generator operation.
I have been able to temporarily remedy the problem by lowering the input current limit to 95A down from 110A. However, that 110A is what it has run at for the past 5 months without issue.
Previously the system has overloaded at generator startup/when the Victrons first accept the power, however these recent overloads have occurred hours into generator operation.
What could have the caused this Quattro to suddenly not be able to handle the incoming current?
Hi, we have a site that comprises of 3 x Multiplus 5KVA II's which is DC coupled with MPPT's. It has been running seamlessly for a couple of years, however this last week one of the inverters has been going into overload and then the system has phase rotation warnings.
The phase in question has stable grid frequency and voltage, and the load is the lowest of the three phases.
We are planning to replace the inverter, however does anyone have any ideas with regards to possible firmware issues or any other suggestions besides just replacing the inverter?
according the manual "VE.bus firmware version explained", it should be no problem, to match
2x MultiPlus-II: (software 2629481)
1x MultiGrid-II: (software 2625481)
together to a three phase system.
I use the latest VE-configuration tools, but it is not possible to do this.
An error messages in VE-Bus Quick configure tells:
Only Multis of same kind and with same firmware version are allowed!
Procedure will be restarted
Switch all devices off and press OK
What is the probleme?
I am currently expanding my RE system with a third multi II inverter to 3 phase from the current 2 phase in parallel. (mulltiplus II 5000/48/70-50) I have purchased some Airpax 150A DC breakers and just wondered if I need to link them all together so if one trips, they all trip. I don't have any 3 phase motors running just 3 separate circuits on the AC side to spread the loads which get quite high when we run air con,etc..
Any help much appreciated
I've done a 3x Multiplus II 5000 set up in a 3 phase configuration and noticed that when the system is set to TOTAL OF ALL PHASES in Multiphase Regulation it will balance the phases to near 0w as far possible by feeding into the grid on L1 the same as it would pull on L2 and L3. But this is not ideal if the grid meter is prepaid as the meter would charge you units for what u are pushing back. If I set it to INDIVIDUAL PHASE it only seems to feed PV into L1 and L2 and L3 dont get any PV benefit. The system consists of: 3x Multiplus II 5000, 2x Smartsolar 150/85, 14kwh Li-ion, and 8.9kwp Solar PV. What am I doing wrong or might it be better to set the 3 inverters up as a parallel system on L1 and put all my heavy loads on L1 if the system is not capable of supplying all 3 phases individually?
I am installing a 3-phase system to a property, where the existing loads are single phase. The only reason its being wired as 3-phase is to future proof for a high speed charger, and because an existing 3 phase supply is already in place from the grid.
I have read in detail the documentation provided by Victron on 3 Phase ESS, with the respective examples, but its not clear enough in my view, sorry Victron.
Does anyone know of any other material where the examples are better set out with text ?
I want to ensure even though most of the loads are on L1, the 3 phase AC inverter, and the 3 x Multi's on the DC side, will not waste the excess energy.
I am trying to set up 3 phase/2 parallel system based on 6 MP-II.
How to set the master and slave in each phase?
i installed 3x MP2 3000VA /48V. Updated Firmware to 2629474. made ve quick config, setted all settings. made the ess assistant in each MP. Now i try everything but the whole system acts like phase compensation is disabled although it is enabled. each inverter does only deliver so much power as required on the specific phase according to the grid meter. No idea why the compensation setting in the venus gx is not working. Please help!!
AC L1,L2,L3 is connected to MPNr.1-ACIN, MPNr2-ACIN, MPNr3-ACIN. The system is useless. If the electric car is plugged in on one phase with 7kW it only delivers max. 2.4kW from one inverter, if no other loads are switched on. If someone cooks on L2, i only get 2.4kW from the inverter on Nr.2.
I read all installation manuals, the training video on the Victron professional side, there is no hint what is wrong, looks like a software bug on the Venus gx!
This issue as been discussed before, but still it is a problem - and a very serious problem
I have a grid-tie 3-phase multiplus 3000/48-32 setup with ESS
In VenusOS I have set grid point to 500W (cut everything above 500W) and I have set "Multiphase regulation" to "Total of all phases"
I now expect the battery system to keep a maximum of 500W imported power.
This is not happening.
When I turn the own on, the total on that phase exceeds the power the victron can give at the moment.
The inverter on L2 is doing what it can, but it cannot compensate for the full load, and 500W is beeing bought from the grid.
The other two inverters are not helping L2 to zero the feed in. They are just zeroring their own phase.
L1 627 W
L2 3179 W
L3 130 W
L1 164 W
L2 683 W
L3 105 W
Solar about 40 W per phase
Total from grid: 952 W
Expected is 500W
When L2 has reached its maximum, L1 or L3 should produce mote power, and even sell power to keep the grid point at 500W
There is no differance in behaviour between "Total of all phases" and "Individual phases" The result is exactly the same. There is no change what so ever.
Expected behaviour is: If grid point is set to 500W, This should be obeyed at all times, even if two phases are selling and one is buying, as long at the total is equal to the grid-set point.
This is a MAJOR bug. This makes the ESS useless out of a zero-feed-in scenario.
Most electricity companies where I live have "Total of all phases" as their means of billing.
"Total of all phases" = make total to grid-point even if it makes other phases sell or use more power that the individual phase requires
Attached pictures show the system with a "grid set point of 500W and "total of all phases""
Yet it is still importing 452W more that expected, even thought L1 and L3 are hardly doing anything (especially L3)
Dear Guy Steart at Victron Expert Community,
I can show you 15 very unsatisfied customers within this forum who all have the same problem.
They are very disappointed about the fact that their investment in 3 phase system is not able to make phase compensation and so their investment is not satisfying their needs.
Loading electric vehicles will not be supported by Victron. Is this your strategy and can you tell us that you dont want to support solutions with ESS+EV's or is it just an unwanted failure and this important change request did never pop up at your programming experts and product managers?
Please look at the threads that are unanswered:
i am planning a solarsystem whit 3x VE MultiPlus-II 48/3000/35-32 ( se more in picture) for a 3-phase system.
I have made a simple wiring diagram over how i´m planning to set it up, am i thinking right?
- I want a 3-phase, for example the heating system needs 3-phase to work.
- UPS-funktion of the whole household
- i want to use as much solar energy i can for myself, more optimised for winter then summer.
- not designing the system to be optimised to sell as much power i can. not selling at ALL right now.
- want to use ESS, have lead-acid batties right now, planning to upgrade to lithium a.s.a.p.
- yes a electrician will connect it all.
I was just hoping a "victron-guru" could take a look and see if i´m totaly off or just maybe close to actually thinking right :-)
For an 3 fase offgrid system with 3 Quattros - will be feeding 2 motors that are controlled by two WEG frequency drives (CFW500)
Is there any risk of that the frequency drives create a bad harmonic that can effect the Quattro inverter.
If yes, how can this be avoided?
Thank you in advance for your thoughts/solutions.