question

andersson avatar image
andersson asked

How to set delayed start for Victron Orion Tr Smart DC-DC charger?

Hello,

Could someone please advise me here?

I have set up 12/12-18 DC-DC charger in a boat, as shown in attached first photo. I'm using battery isolator, to ensure that I do not charge Service battery from the Starter battery.dc-dc-installation-with-battery-isolator.jpg

My goal is to have the Starter battery (Lead-Acid) to be charged first and charging of the Service battery (Lithium) with DC-DC charger will be delayed until Starter battery is fully charged.
Engine's start current is 250A and it starts normally with 2 secs. Starter battery is 77Ah Lead Acid, so the charging current of starter battery should be around 19A (25% of capacity). Therefore I estimated that it would take around 20...30 sec to full charge starting battery after starting the engine.
I had tried different "Delayed start voltage" (13.8V, 13.9V, 14V) and different "Start voltage" (14V, 14.1V), but still charging of the Service battery starts very quickly- within 2....5 seconds.
May be somebody could give me a hint- which settings/values to use in Orion set up for delayed start?

dc-dc-settings.jpg

The reason why I wish to have delayed start:

when I charge both batteries at the same time, then total charging current from alternator is about 40A and I'm wondering if this could burn up the alternator?

The alternator is 60A, Hitachi LR160-741, that generates only 25-35A at idle at low RPM (1500...2000). Alternator's characteristics:https://www.manualslib.com/manual/825607/Yanmar-3ym30.html?page=206&fbclid=IwAR07sVdwhNENhgF4O7F3s0Nu6ELvCxN_KlTzMcJEjv_O_o4GsgIIxWn5Wog#manual

orion-tr smart
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6 Answers
David avatar image
David answered ·

If you always want a delayed start, set the Start Voltage to a higher voltage than the alternator can deliver.

As soon as the voltage reaches the Start Voltage, the Charger will activate by design, so using the Delayed Voltage value instead would be the best option.

Another approach you could take is to wire up a countdown timer to the Remote Connection powered up the ignition.

I have a different Battery-to-Battery charger, but I also use a Delayed Start option as I think it is a good idea :)

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andersson avatar image andersson commented ·

Thank you wildebus!

My alternator can deliver max 14.4V (by specs) and it does charge the battery with 14.2V.

Should I set then "Start voltage" as 14.3V and keep the "Delayed start voltage" as it is by default: 13.8V... and then start delay will be always enabled?

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David avatar image David andersson commented ·

I would probably put the voltage at 14.5V - above the maximum - to ensure it doesn't start up immediately.

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dc4me avatar image
dc4me answered ·

The Hitachi 60A alternator has a really dumb internal regulator. Asking 40 amps output for a significant time over and over will probably not be good for a long life. I think 40 amps will be the upper output of that alternator after it gets warmed up. Depending on your engine your inrush current my be 250 amps but how much it drains your starter bank is minimal. One thing I would think happens is your lead-acid battery has a different resistance that the Lithium has and would throw off the voltage needed to stay in the 14v range. Your lead-acid with it's resistance at 80% or higher SOC would go into a different charging parameter therefore drop in voltage output. As I stated at first with the internal regualtor being a really dumb regulator. If I was trying to do this I would look at switching your priorities and charging your house bank as a priority and using an ACR to charge starter bank. But I would look into that direction to see if it is a solution. Mixing battery chemistries is something that works only if it is done right. good luck.

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kevgermany avatar image
kevgermany answered ·


This from the online manual:

"Start voltage (Vstart): At this level charging starts immediately. Default: 14V.

Delayed start voltage (Vstart(delay)): Smart alternators can generate a lower voltage when the engine is running, therefore a lower start level is necessary for these systems. To ensure that the starter battery is recharged after starting the engine, charging of the auxiliary battery is delayed during this condition. The energy used during starting must be replenished to ensure that the starter battery remains properly charged. Default: 13.3V (Smart Alternator) and 13.8 (Regular Alternator).

Delayed start voltage delay (tstart delay): Recharge time for the starter battery during start level (delayed). Example: If the starter draws 150A for 5sec to start the engine, about ~0.2Ah is drawn from the starter battery. If, during engine idling, the alternator can only generate 20A, it takes 150A/20A x 5sec =37.5sec to recharge the starter battery. Default: 2 minutes."


So what @Wildebus is saying is that you must prevent the start voltage setting from initiating charging, this will make the Orion work from the delayed settings and obey the time delay there.


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andersson avatar image
andersson answered ·

Thank you all for your answers!

I will try new settings (Start Voltage 14.5V; Delayed Start Voltage 14,3V) on next week, when I'm on boat again .

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kevgermany avatar image kevgermany ♦♦ commented ·
Delayed start is too high, if the alternator is charging at 14.2V, it needs to be lower than that. Go with the defaults from the manual quote above.
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andersson avatar image andersson kevgermany ♦♦ commented ·

Thank you @kevgermany!

Will try on next week: Delayed Start Voltage 13.8V and Start Voltage 14.5V.

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andersson avatar image
andersson answered ·

The issue is solved now.

I set "Start Voltage" = 14.5V and kept the "Delayed Start Voltage" = 13.8V.

And now the delayed start is activated as we wished.

Thank you all for your answers!

delayed-start-voltage.jpg


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Edouard Lafargue avatar image
Edouard Lafargue answered ·

@andersson : I am planning to install the same sort of circuit soon - alternator -> battery isolator then one output of the isolator to a lead-acid battery, and the other one to an Orion charger.

Are you still using this setup, and is it still working fine for you? I know that connecting an Orion charger directly to an alternator is not a great idea if there is no battery in between, but it looks to me like a battery isolator should be perfectly fine, so I'd love to get long-term feedback on how your system is doing!

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